Hi Jasmin,
Monty says: "Let the horses do the talking!", so seeing the difference from your work can be a very good argument. Still I know some people want to be "important" to their personal horse, they want to think the horse does these "sweet" things only with them. You cannot do more than explain what reason there is for respect, show how the horse responds well to your training and then..... let go.
These people have to make their own choices, give them good arguments and then back off.
Good chances they realise that you're doing a great job and the horse feels much happier, when bounderies are clear.
Sometimes you have to just accept it, that people don't want to see the benefit, at least you did your best! You will find other horses you could work with.
Others may find your work interesting, would even give it a try, if you invite them to do it themselves. There you can be proud of yourself, letting the person make his own choice and let the horse do the talking!
Good luck with your Intro work,
Miriam

Just to support Miriam's response - all we can do as teachers is to do our best by knowing our subject manner well and dmonstrating this to our students in an enlightening and interesting way. Unfortunately some students will learn and progress while others will not. Hang in there - you have one good result and via demonstration and encouragement the others just may come on board too. People are harder than horses to teach!!!

Oops! typos - subject matter!

I think sometimes we need to get real serious with owners about their responsibility of being a good owner. Some people have this idea that being a good owner is about spoiling their animals like babies, what they don't realize is the harm this attitude causes and then they're frustrated when their horse is disrespectful and difficult to handle. I still have to get after my husband not to hand feed my horses because he's undermining all the hard work I've done. Don't be afraid to explain to owners in a very serious but respectful way the dangers of not being consistent with the concepts of your training, otherwise they will not only make your job harder but in the end they might decide your methods aren't very effective because they're undermining your training and the horse is getting mixed messages.
I hope you can resolve these issues, keep us posted on your progress.
Kleinne

I hear you loud and clear! Yesterday I had two ladies and a 14 or 15 year old girl stop over the were looking for a "horse trainer" I told them I was an instructor and I don't do outside training, who sent you? they said Jane - I though to myself she sure knows that I don't train... The kid rambled of how the 8 year old mare had gotten agressive then said I just want a trainer to teach the horse to "trail ride alone, and not come after me". I asked how long they had the horse> 3 years. How old was the mare when you got her? 5 years. Was the mare trained when you got her? - No..the kid was the only one working with her - I asked who bought an unbroke adult horse for a kid? ...I looked at them and said the horse needs a new zip code and the girl needs lessons. It sounds like the horse is alfa and the kid is going to have a hard time getting alfa back unless she learns the language. The older lady (I assume sold them the horse) went back and forth about the horse just needs to be ridden by a trainer...I could tell she was the closed mind type.. I don't deal with that type any more, unless someone wants to listen give them the ultimatum, it's my way or the highway. They left. sometimes it takes a hard hand to wake people up.

Hi everybody again!
Thank you soo much for all your advices!
.
Miriam and MaggieF: Thank you for the advice that demonstration might be the best teacher for these people. But last time, when I was doing my first session about loading, they did not even really watch me. They listened, when I was telling what I am doing, but as soon as I was going back to work again, they were talking, doing things with the other horse (which I was not training at that moment) or planning their weekend with friends/family via mobile phone. Some of theses things were always happening, as soon as I was looking over to them for just a small moment.
.
Kleinne and LonaFende: Yes, maybe I have to get more serious about this topic with them. I know that we can't help all of them, but as soon as I will stop my training with these horses, they will get the same problems again. And this is what makes me really sad and worries me a lot, because I know that it will become dangerous for the horses and their owners at some point in time.
.
Of course, I will keep you posted on my progress. On Friday this week I will do the next session on loading the same horses again plus the last one, which I was not able to load until now. (He had an inflammation on his fetlock joint for the last few weeks.)
.
All of you are so right. Of course, talking to these owners way more serious about this topic might help a lot, but Iam having some problems on my self about how to approach people (especially those I do not know for many years). Maybe I have to become more brave with people, as I already did with horses.
.
And of course, we sometimes have to "Let the horses do the talking" for us. But what, if people do not listen to them?
.
Thank you again.
Love,
Jasmin

Hi Jasmin,
I remember from some other post, you are also training to become a horsetherapist, forgot what kind exactly. As you gain expertise on the field you're working , you will also win authority. I mean natural authority, from knowing your skills and seeing what needs to be done. This will give you more selfconfidence when dealing with people in the long run.
Keep learning from the horses, you'll find a way to get your message to the owners, maybe not right now, but with time.
Let the horses be you teachers,
Miriam

Hi Miriam!
Yes, you are right. Wow, I would never have imagined that someone would remember what I am learning at the moment, because it is some time ago that I made a post on my own.
.
So thank you for that! Yes, I am doing a traineeship to become a horsetherapist. I am going to be non-medical practitioner, physiotherapist and chiropractor for horses, dogs and cats someday (hopefully at the end of next year?).
.
Yeah, maybe I will develope more selfconfidence with people within my time of working with horses. The horses are the best teachers I have ever had, so, why not?
Thank you again.
.
Love,
Jasmin

Hi again!
.
So, it is some time ago that I posted on this topic.
Last Friday I had my second training on loading and have been talking to the owners about what I am going to do with their horses and what bothered me the last time.
.
They seemed to understand me better now, but one of the two owners was not there, only a young woman who has a riding partnership on this horse.
.
I had the mare at the Dually Halter while explaining how dangerous it can be when people are inconsequent with their horses. And it was at the right time, because the horse I had on the Dually got disrespetful and tried to seek for food in my pockets. I schooled her for this behaviour and she tried it again. I schooled her again and then she did no more try it.
.
I worked her on the Dually to step forward and backwards with me. Then I asked the women if thy thought I could move backwards to the end of the line without her moving a foot? Reaction: unbelievable looks.
So, I stepped backwards, and she did not move.
After that I have offered them to show them how to do this and when to school a horse and how. They did not say anithyng about this, and at the end I did not show them anything, because they did not ask.
.
So, that is what happened until now. Hopefully something will change.
.
Have a nice day.
Jasmin

Jasmin,
You can only do your best and you are doing this.
Sometimes shock treatment has to come into play. The internet is a great place to show people the results of a disrespectful horse.
Example; on your browser type in horsebites, wow, what will come up.
Next horse kicks, again wow !!!
Sometime a picture is worth a 1,000 words.
Ronda

Ronda, wow, it is horrible what you can see if you google these two pictures. Maybe I can show my horse owners one or two of these pictures,
what do you think?
Jasmin

Hi everybody again!
.
Yesterday I had a great success!
The mare I am working with, won't move a foot as soon as you walk her in front of the ramp of a trailer. I have been working on this problem three times now (each time about half an hour). At the end of the first training session I got her to put her front feet on the ramp. Before that she was just planting her feet, and started rearing when I put too much pressure on the Dually (she responds very good to the halter, when we are not around a trailer). After I got her on the ramp with her front feet two times I stopped for that day (as a reward).
.
The second time she started rearing again. This time I schooled her for everything negative (also the rearing). At the end I got her with the front feet on the ramp again (without any problems anymore) and she reached into the trailer with her head and sniffed around. That's where I stopped the training for that day.
.
Yesterday was my third session with her. One time I got her to put all for feet on the ramp. She did no more rear or backup, because she did not want to get schooled again.
Then I started to put her front feet on the ramp, then backing her up again. I repeated this process so many times. At the end I thought: I want her to put all four feet on the ramp one more time, then I will stop for that day.
.
When I got her on the ramp with all four feet again (only about five minutes later) she walked right into the trailer, without me asking her for that!
.
I have no idea how and why this happened, maybe because she did not want to back up over and over again. But it happened! I stopped the training at this point to reward her.
.
I know that I am not ready on working with this mare, she had a bad experience with the trailer, as most non-loaders did. And now I know her problem: Her owner wanted to take her on a trip to Africa last year, and put leg protectors on her. She did never have something like this on her legs, and panicked in the trailer. So that's what she is still associating with the trailer now.
.
Have a nice day.
Best wishes from Hamburg, Germany,
Jasmin

Hi Jasmin,
Congratulations!
It sounds like you're doing a great job and this is going to convince whoever was sceptical in the beginning.
Maybe you could desensitize the mare's legs, since her problem seems associated with the legprotectors. Plastic on a stick, first the side of the stick without the plastic, etc. She trusts you, so you can build on that now.
Keep us posted!
Miriam

Hi Miriam,
thank you. It is a great idea to desensitize her legs. Her owner wants to take her to Africa again in May this year. So I will have to work on that hardly. Although I think it is a terrible thing to take a horse on a journey of about 3500 kilometres. I will talk to her owner about that point too.
Yes, I will keep you posted on that - that's for sure!

Have a nice day!
Jasmin

Jasmin,
Well done !!!! Just described what Monty does.. Back up and forward, back up and forward and you proved it works, yeah !!! I love watching him load a horse, sounds like I would like to see you do this as well. I love success for us all.
I have been re-reading Montys' book and can't wait until our latest snow is gone and I can put into practise what I have re-learned.
Can't wait for your next post.
Ronda

Hello, all of you!
Definitely, horses are faster learners than us, humans......I made the so common mistake of feeding Willow by hand. Not always but the typical treat, etc... And I have to thank her for her gentle spirit beacause she does not bite. But she does lip my hands and now I KNOW I DID WRONG, don´t scold,please.I learned , finally. But to undo the wrong I have to be patient and consistent. I have told my people not to give her anything by hand. A carrot? We put it on the ground near her. Piece of bread while I am preparing her food? I leave it on top of the rabbit cage by her door where she can reach it.She will learn fast but I will have to keep reminding myself that she and I have ways of comunicating our "love" for each other that do not involve food or titbits. I keep thinking about what Monty said. A horse´s food never ran away.
When I was a little girl, some horse-pulled cart of coal or vegetables used to park in front of our building. My way of "making friends" with the horse was by offering it an apple on the palm of my hand, That way I could get the horse to let me rub its forehead. That made me soooo happy as I dreamed of having a horse myself. And as dogs and cats are different in this I just assumed it was a "friendly" practice. Now I know better. When Willow arrived I still didn´t know a lot of the basics of Monty´s system and I made that mistake. Considering the fact that I never had any experience "educating" a horse and only three months of riding lessons and dealing with the two or three horses I rode then, I feel I am not doing so bad.... Willow seems happy and seems to consider me "her herd".It is a fascinating thing, this bdoy language, so much like dancing, and learning it in order to have a better relationship with this beautiful creature is a wonder. But I bet us all that Willow will learn her lesson much quicker than all the humans in my surronding learn that Monty´s methods work better.
Jasmin do not despair! You are doing a lot! keep it up. I will too.
Happy Spring,
Christy

Hi Christy,
Don't feel too bad about feeding your horse, your learning as the rest of us have.
I would like to mention about bread and horses. If I am not mistaken, yeast and wheat are a no no for horses. I believe I read it can contribute to colic.
Maybe you can look this up on the internet and check it out for yourself, OK.
Ronda

Hi Christy and Ronda!
.
Thank you very much for your feedbacks!
.
Christy, you are so right, horses are learning so much faster than humans, although many people tell they were silly. They are not, if you see (for example) headshy horses developing to trusting animals, following you around and letting you touch them where ever you want to, if you just don't hurt them! In summer last year I have been to California and at Flag Is Up Farms. I have been talking to Monty together with several other students, and it made us really sad when we heard that there are only about 3000-4000 student learning on this Uni. So many people know about his techniques, and there are so many who do not use it, although they know it is the right way to work with a horse. I think this is really sad.
.
Keep on going this way, and you will start thinking in bigger dimensions than making a partnership out of food. You are on the right way to get a very good student of these techniques!
.
Hi Ronda, yes, you are right. Bread is not a good thing to feed your horse with. If you do it sometimes and only take one or two slices of bread, it is okay. But if you do this every day, than it can lead to colic or even laminitis! So, keep your horses save and feed them good things!
.
Today I will get a new horse to train. It is a Holsteiner yearling, a small filly. Her owner buys abused mares and lets them get a baby first. Then, after one and a half years or so, she starts training them again without any force or painful experiences. After they got able to be ridden again, she sells them and their foals to nice people.
In this case, the filly doesn't know anything. Her owner is able to touch her, but that is all she knows. She does not even know a halter, because her owner had an apoplectic stroke last year. Now she got an degenerative illness and can't even halter a horse. So that's why she engaged me, and I am really excited about that!
.
Have a nice day,
Jasmin from Hamburg, Germany