Hi everyone,
I have recently acquired a 3.5 year old thoroughbred stallion who was abandoned at a racetrack. He had been living in a box for about 6 months, he was never taken out of the box and it wasn't cleaned at all so he came to me in a very bad state. He has spent his first 3 months with me out at grass and on rest as he was very lame, and had severe liver and kidney issues (these are better now and he has put a lot of weight back on). He is recovering well and is almost back to a place where we can start doing serious work. He is a very chilled out stallion and loves to be with people. He always comes trotting to the gate when someone goes to get him in and he will usually follow me around like a puppy dog with or without a lead rope on. Now that he is feeling better and has put on some weight he is starting to get more energetic, he is never aggressive but does get pushy and goes into peoples space a lot of the time. He is also fussy about his back legs and occasionally tries to kick out when we handle his back feet.
I have just started working with him in our round pen. He has learnt how to respect space in the round pen and we are getting better with controlling his gait. He will walk, trot, and canter on demand and I haven't started working with him on a stop yet. He is focused on me in the round pen and always has one ear and his eyes on me when working. My problem is that he has absolutely no fear of anything, he never spooks, I can throw plastic bottles over his back and he doesn't even blink, the tractor can be working inches away from him and he won't even stop grazing. So in the round pen when I try to turn him he just continues going around me, I have tried moving in front of the shoulder, holding the whip in front of him to block him, even just standing in his path, and he just doesn't care. He will trot right through the whip with it touching him, and if i am in front he just skips around me. I can get him to work on both side by just turning him in the other direction using his head collar, but I am stuck with trying to get him to understand the turn signal. I have never had a problem turning other horses in the round pen but I don't know if just doesn't get it or if he is refusing to do it? Any suggestions would be great.
He is a big 17hh horse and is going to be a very strong horse later. As he is a stallion I really want to get the communication right with him before I start riding him.
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Horse Behavior and Training
Stallion doesn't respond to turn signals in round pen
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Hi. Welcome Meg. Before I start making suggestions, please bear with me as I make sure these suggestions are appropriate - bit of a bore but better than me advising you into a dangerous situation, I'm sure you'll agree. You've rescued a large, powerful stallion so I assume, together with what you've described in your post, you have some significant experience with horses. However, you refer to use of a whip & have no accreditations on the Uni. Do you use Montys methods? Have you done Join up? Why is this boy still entire? In Britain, once past 2 years old you are, by law, required to register a stallion & pay an annual fee. I have gelded my stallion as I have all the foals I wanted & with internal testicles, no one else would want to use my majestic cob. Humphrey has performed impeccably, a perfect gent since being a 2 year old, 3 perfect foals - boys with external bits & very gentle girl. I'm confident we can overcome your problems. Please post back so we can proceed. Lots of luck, Jo.
Yes I have experience with horses but this is the first horse I have started in the round pen. The others were already in training when I started working with them. I live in Peru at the moment and most of our horses are not gelded. Mainly because there is no one here who knows how to castrate horses properly. We have 15 stallions currently who live together in groups of 4 or 5. I know it is strange given that usually stables in the uk or Canada don't keep many stallions. However ours live quite happily together and we have never had any fights. When our mares are in heat we keep them separated. My boy doesn't live with other stallions but he goes out loose with a couple of geldings and he is defiantly the lowest in the pecking order. They do not train with round pens here but I like using them and have joined up with a couple of my other horses. I want to start my boy using the round pen. I use a lunge whip in the round pen instead of a rope as I feel more confident using it properly. I always get ropes tangled up! I have never used it on my horse. Just as a guide so I don't have to get to close to his backend. As I said he is doing well and is responsive to me but I'm still having issues with turning him. He is not nervous or hyperactive in the pen and it seems to really settle him down. I am only working him at a walk and trot at the moment because of his leg and I am apprehensive about asking him to turn at speed as he is not fully recovered yet.
Hi. Thank you for responding, Meg. I would procede with this horse as follows. First, I would achieve 'Join up' - this would put me in the 'alpha mare' situation in his mind ( the only herd member to definitely out rank him ). I would use a bamboo cane instead of a whip. The cane would have a large amount of plastic attached to one end - a bin bag or many carrier bags as well as some strips. Working this horse in the round pen I would flap the plastic in this horses way - he will turn from it. I would make sure I was calm & consistent, standing behind the driving point & making sure he always had room between my body, the plastic & the round pen wall to safely make the turns. I started on the Monty journey after 50 years with horses, the last 15 of which I had questioned why, if I loved horses, was I being so violent towards them. The final straw was a little chestnut mare called Bella. I started her but, after much success she went through a phase of stopping & gazing into the distance, for up to 15 minutes. Nothing I did moved her. Finally, I took a whip & when Bella planted herself I gave her ample opportunity to move before giving her a single mighty smack. She didn't bat an eyelash! I had never used violence with her before, she was 4 & had been in my care since she was 6 months old. Her acceptance, that this was part of the deal, reduced me to tears & the whip went in the bin - for ever! I lost Bella last November but she has left me with Kirk, turning 2 later this month & a filly of 10 months. The Monty journey is a joy that every horse lover will never regret taking. Good luck. Jo.
Hi Meg,
I'd start by working on the stop issue. You need to be able to stop him, then you can turn him around, then work on backing him up. Sounds to me like he simply doesn't understand what your asking him in the round pen.
"get pushy and goes into peoples space" That's never good especially with a stallion, it can easily become a way to move people around and that would increase his dominance. And dominance is something you don't want in a stallion. Working on moving him backward would help, Join-Up also. A thoroughbred stallion can become quite a handful, so you must take a leadership role as soon as possible.
Good luck!
Hiya-firstly you lucky thing id love a non spooky horse!!
I agree with the above, especially binning the whip and working on your stops. There are lessons specifically on stopping on here which if you haven't seen them are great!
As for the turning issue, Ive had Chris Morris over now w few times with my boy (who is spooky but i wont bore you with the details) and he has taught me the 'pointy game'. Start off with him on the dually, for this i do use the middle 'normal' ring as it's easier.
Start by standing slightly to one side of him and point with your the hand furthest away, with the lead rope in that hand and increase pressure until he tales a step. Release and give him a rub. Do this so he goes both ways, walking past you when you point in that direction. In the end he should go the direction you point at. I kid you not it really does work!!!
Good luck!
Also i forgot to say, make sure you keep your other arm, hand, still by your side, you'd be surprised how you can easily do a scarecrow impression!