I had the most wonderful gental horse that I have raised since he was 7 mths old. At the age of 4 I sent him off to a stable to have a woman "Break" him for me.....( I was healing from injuries, not horse related, and trying to decide if I would get out of hobby farming after selling off all my other farm critters... except Brisco.)
Please note that I never had any fear from this loving animal,as I did alot off ground work, handling, nurturing him through laminitis, and he never ever showed any aggression, striking out, or any bad behavior. He has always been level headed in stessfull situations,(like gettting a skid stuck over his head, or getting stuck under a fence,or 120 quills stuck in his face and fetlock..)
I thought his progress was going very well, and she stated to me that she was amazed at how fast a learner he was...
I was ready to bring him home after 5 mths. of his being away... them BANG.... everything chaged in a moment. Acctualy the one time I was tacking him up and a stable girl came in to the barn and startled him... he broke out of his cross ties and ran out of the barn and down the driveway. I went after him and brought him back to the barn,finished tacking, and took him out to work him and ride.
Then the next week I was tacking him up, saddle on, there was a lady also tacking up down the ille,(not something he had not done before, but a different horse maybe) then all Hell broke loose! His head went down, his back arched,and he started to buck and kick around breaking off his cross ties, he looked like he just came out of the shute at the rodeo.. My siter got banged into the pens, I got out of the way, but Brisco turned and after the other ladies horse also broke off and left the barn, the lady tried to get out of his way and get out the door.. but it was to late. They went out together, him in a panic, and down she went...She ended up with a plate and 8 screws in her ankle with 2 compound fractures....I was so upset, and my horse had run off into a pen with his ears pinned back, nostrils flared, no one could get near him. We have no idea what came over him, but this was to traumatic for me and him, that thigs have just gone down hill.
First the trainer put him in a pen alone away fron his pasture buds, and when she tacked him up the next times, made up this thing that went around his neck and attached to the rafters of the barn. She made him stand there for I don't know how long. I have then witnesed her strike
him with the crop for not standing at the mount, and god only knows what else has happened there! My gut told me to get him out of there, but I am afraid that it was not soon enough. Thinking that she new how to handle horses better that I, and that she was the "expert"...in my heart I knew he had to come back home.
So here we are...I am petrified of my horse, and can not seem to get his behavior out of my mind. I thought I would get back to basics with him, groung work, free lunging with join up amd follow up... I managed to do it once, and he was ok. I even had an expert come to asses him and she confirmed that he has been "Broken" but in a bad way. She pointed out all the things this so called trainer did that has undone all I did before he left. Brisco will not come to me willingly any more, and the other day when I tried to work with him free lunging, he went nuts again. He ran around with his ears pined back, kicking out, bucking, he looked so fearfull.. I had to get out of the arena for my own saftey. I was shaking so bad and had to wait to get calmed down before going back in with him.
I am afraid that now he know if he does that behavior he can get away with it, and I am having such a hard time thinking now I can no longer handle him and I will have to give him up to a rescure farm. I would never be able to sell him and worry that some one else would abuse him or that he would hurt someone else again.
Any thoughts on this matter would help, or sugestions on what I should do. Can I still fix my Broken horse?
I'm so sorry this horrible thing happened to your boy! Some trainers aren't even worth giving the time of day to.
Of course you can repair your relationship with him. As always, start small. Join-up is the first goal, and once that is accomplished, just take it easy for a while. Don't work or school him, just try to gain his trust. Follow-up for a good long while. Pet him, stroke him, give him loves. Start small, stay safe!
I had some of the same issues with my horse when I got her. Dangerous behavior is always a result of fear, and it may take a while, but when you have a horses trust, everything else comes naturally.
Hi Rldrapeau - this is such a sad story but one I am all too familiar with. Sadly there are still far too many brutal, traditional breakers with all sorts of awful equipment and ideas that have never heard of Monty and can ruin our beautiful horses so easily. It didn't take any time for a rough guy and his mate to ruin my Uggs for life. Just long enough time for them to tie him down, ear twitch him and belt him around just to get a rug that had slipped off him. So it is a lesson I have learnt and one that we all should be mindful of - never trust your horse with someone else unless you can be there too to observe what happens or unless you know this person very well and are very familiar with their training methods. This is one of the main reasons why I broke in Tricka myself. She has such a strong personality that I was fearful that she would be badly treated and end up like her mother, Pie. Pie was broken down and terrified for life when she was only three by a brute of a man who was austensibly re-training her. Brisco has obviously had a horrific 5 months away from you and it will take a very long time for you to know regain his trust. I am not as confident as Nadine that you can fully repair your relationship as he will never be the same trusting horse again. It is very hard to advise you here as you now have a dangerous horse on your hands and your own safety is paramount. You mentioned you had an expert come and assess him for you. She sounds as if she knows what he has been through. Is it possible for her to help you try to re-train him? I do feel you need some professional help here from someone who is gentle and kind and supportive of gentle training methods. Initially I would just give him some space. Put him into a paddock/field and allow him to relax for a few days - just go out and talk to him each day and give him some food. Once he has had a bit of time by himself then start doing some of the things you did with him when you first got him as he will remember those times too Slowly try to build up that relationship again just as you did the first time. Whether or not you can still fix your Broken horse will depend very much on how badly he has been treated and on his personality. I think with time and patience you can certainly start the healing process but he may never be quite the same horse again. If it was me I would give him a month or so and then make your own decision as to whether you can bring him back or not. If possible avoid any hasty decision about giving him away to a rescue farm. Have a good try first yourself - maybe with some professional help. Work with him for a few months - dually halter work, try join-up but have a wand with you in case he acts up. Be gentle but firm - use the dually halter to gain his respect but wear gloves and helmet and have a long lead rope so you can control him. Keep a wand or dressage whip handy in case he does come at you - only use it if you need to defend yourself then waving it at him should be sufficient. Here's the hardest one - stay calm, keep breathing, talk to him and try not to let him know you are scared of him. It is a tough task you have on your hands so good luck with it.
Great advice from both Nadine and Maggie. Not much I can add, but horses dont forget. Give him plenty of time, love, and friendship, I think he will come around when he remembers what you had together. But it will take time and patience. You cant hurry it, so dont try. You had him for four years, he will remember that.
What a terrible terrible thing to happen to you both, my heart goes out to you. As above, I can add nothing of any use other than encouragement to give your boy a lot of time. Just hang around in the field with him and imagine you are starting all over again - let him come and find you. It will feel like it will never happen, but trust us, it will in time. And tell all your friends and anyone you know not to go to that trainer!
When oh when are we going to get people prosecuted under Animal Welfare Law for these behaviours - if is was going on in a training school with any other animal there would be an outcry and yet it goes unreported and even condoned in the horse world. Ok end of my rant! :-)
I agree with the other sentiments expressed here, some great advice for you, just take things slowly and carefully. The methods and behaviour used by some so called horsemen and women is beyond belief. I am so sorry that this person has done such a poor job with your horse. The one positive thing is that although he has been treated badly by the trainer, it was not you that did it to him so perhaps after some time out to just relax and be a horse you may find some of the old trust returning. Spend some time just being with him, so that there is no pressure on either of you, and hopefully he may start to come round. It will not be a quick fix by any means, and will take time and effort, but it is worth a try. Stay safe and good luck.
Thank you all for you words of support ....I will keep you posted on his progress and mine. I know it will take time and just taking each day as it comes. He has always been a courious horse and I hope he remembers that he is home now, and I never hurt him before here. He seems to be settled a bit more with each day that goes by....
Hi, No such a bad experience as you've had, but we had a new girl on the yard that was going to be moving horses on, she wanted to know why we'd not yet gotten on bamBams back and scoffed at the idea that he was just only over 2 yrs old. She went and got her training bridal with the 3 rings around the nose and said he should be in training now, I might ad she'd been boasting sll this time that she'd been training racehorses and breaking them in for years in Ireland and France. Unsure what she was going to do and thinking I might be learning something from her, I let her show me how to train him, never again and my curtness to her afterwards has thankfullu prevented her coming to the yard again.
She forced him around the field with this training bridal and he had no choice but to go where she was pulling him, then she was jumping up and down beside him, then she jumped on him laying across his back, addining in here she must be about 15 stone and our BamBam was only 12.2 hands. He buckled under her weight.
When i got her to leave the field, BamBam was angry and he was throwing his head around, ears pinned back, for 3 days he wouldnt let us near him and grabbed the food bucket from us at meal times.
I couldnt get near him even to put the daully on him, so I tried soemthing else. When the horse trusts us and wants to join up, there is the licking and chewing and then the join up. So I started to imitate grazing next to his field (A good way to pull the weeds at the same time :) ) After about a week of not expecting him to come and me not going to fetch him, he started to come and graze next to me, we now have a weekly ritual of me weeding next to him as he chomps away. It was this I'll graze here and not interfer with you amd let you come to me that built the trust up again that was lost when I foolishly listened to this woman. Sometimes just being there and letting them choose you're safe is a good way forward. Once he see's your safe then ease him back into the working relationship you had before. Monty would say, sit down and rethink and you'll come up with a solution. The forum helps too :D
Mel
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So sad to hear that you and Bambam have also had a bad experience, Mel. Do hope they both grow to trust you again. I have had two horses totally ruined by cruel, thoughtless trainers. My Pie was broken down and crippled for life by a guy who tried to re-train her and Uggs has always been scared since his ordeal. Uggs has slowly re-gained his trust in me but he remains easily spooked and it is now over 10 years since the men attacked him. He was only four at the time and I had only owned him for just over twelve months so it was early in his training. He had been started by a Monty type trainer who couldn't have been very good as you couldn't approach him head on. Soon as you turned your back to him in he would come. Of course the stupid guys who attacked him had never heard of Monty so when he ran off when they approached him they proceeded to drive him into a corner and then rope him, tied his lega up tipped him over and ear twitched him - all just to remove his rug. It was when he was on my parents property in nothern NSW and I had unfortunately come back to Melbourne for a fortnight. The care takers noticed his rug had slipped so asked these guys to fix it for them. Unthinking cruel people can do so much damage to these beautiful animals and it doesn't take them long to ruin a horse for life. I just wish we could somehow have these cruel training practices outlawed across the world. Dream on me. Yesterday our riding instructor told us how a friend of hers stopped his horse rushing out of a float. He apparently drove it down to the end of a peer on Port Phillip Bay in Melbourne and when he opened the tail gate the horse flew back into the bay and had to swim out! I DID NOT think that was very funny or amusing! We need to learn never let anyone go near our horse unless we know them really well and trust them. These days I am very cautious. On Sunday I am going as a spectator to Andrew McLean's clinic to observe. If I like what I see then I may take Tricka later. Thinking of doing the same with Lynn Mitchell.
Bit of advice. Dont EVER let anyone near your horse unless you know them very well, and NEVER without your being there. And do NOT hesitate to say something if the person starts to do anything you dont approve of. Your horses life and well being depend on it. Check out all trainers before letting them near your horse. Ask around and observe for yourself before making any decisions. And if anyone ever wants to ride your horse, first talk to them, find out how they think. Years ago I was talking to a girl and mentioned I like to be friends with my horses, she said she didnt care about that, or getting to know them, all she wanted to do was ride. I didnt have a horse at the time, but decided then and there, if I got one, she wouldnt be allowed near it. Sounded to me like she didnt care about horses at all. And more recently, a woman I know came to see Princess and brought her boyfriends brother, he insisted his cousin could break Princess in no time, no matter how many times I told him I was doing just fine on my own and didnt need any help. Fibnally I ignored him and told her later not to bring him out again. At the time, the only problem I had was getting her to go, and I didnt need anyone coming along to hurry things up. She was only 2 and we had plenty of time. We solved that problem with no stress. And she still isnt afraid of anything. I am not a professional trainer, never claimed to be, but have quite a bit of experience and I have never harmed a horse yet, and dont intend to. I have started several horses using a lot of Montys methods before I ever heard of him. My object has always been to get the horse to do what I want because he WANTS to, not because he HAS to, or is afraid not to. And I have NO patience with anyone who mistreats a horse, that really sets me off.
Well said Phantommustang! We should all take careful note of this for our horses' sakes.
The most wonderful thing about reading this entry in the forum is how true to Monty's ethos all these responses are. It is just great and I'm sure he would be very proud of all of you for your suggestions and support. To Ridrapeau good luck with your trust rebuilding with your horse. I rescued a mare in 2009 who had been beaten, twitched, leg tied damaging the bone in the front leg and persevered with gaining her trust. It took some time but she is a well balanced girl now with only 2 months till she has her first goal. I hope you have the same joy I have experienced. My heart melts every time she runs up the paddock to see me - although fat waddle these days lol. Lots of patience, kindness and gentleness - good luck. Jan
Hi Griffo.girl - this brought tears to my eyes. Damaged horses do slowly learn to trust and it is so rewarding to note their progress.
Thanks again every one for you help... I am trying every day to just get out in the feild with my horse, (and the 2 little goats) and just walk around, picking weeds or sticks that are laying around, sitting on a rock.... and slowley his ears perk up and then he will slowly come over to me...
He still pins his hears back though when I try to pat him...this bothers me, some times he will walk a bit with me, but then just goes back to grazing. Thats ok... baby steps first. I have managed to just walk him on the lead in the feilds with no demands of working other than whao, and back ups and forward, we do a bit of grooming and leave it at that.... Tomorow is another day.
Sounds like you are doing fine, just keep it slow and easy, no demands. He is coming around, just takes time.
You are making progress already - it will be slow but patience and kindness will win through - best wishes from Jan
One other thing I wanted to say regarding the ears pinning back when you go to pat him - my mare used to be like that but it was just that she associated hand movements towards her with pain and violence. Only rub between the eyes on the forehead to start if he will let you and be prepared that it may take time to even be able to do this. Patting anywhere else on the body at this early stage may seem like a threat after what he has been through. Regards Jan
Maggie, love the fire you have, I think thats something I'll have to work on!! I've always hated violence of any sort especially when it comes to the person or animal having no choice and no escape route.
I understand by what you mean that people just want to ride and i find it quite fustrating how riding schools support that belief of 'just riding' , there's not real training or enabling the rider to connect with the horse.
phantommustang I agree with you totally. Been reading over what you've said and it occured to me that because I have no 'qualifications' in horse riding, even though I've been involved with riding and stable management for over 10 yrs, that if someone says they have then I tend to back down because I have no visible qualifications. but not everyone is going to do things for the benefit of our horses, so your words have goven me the kick to be stronger and speak out if it's not inline with what I know and want our ponies life to be.
I called the landlord yeaterday and wanted to know if he's sold the property yet where we are, he's said no so I let him know that I was going to weed the field and maintain it fully, it's not been cared for for years and it's covered with what looks like rape seed, I'm not quite sure what it is yet but but it's got to go. So taking avdantage of the early autum grass spurt I've confined BamBam to the school area and was going to prepare the fileds ready for a farmer to come and spray, oh it's got tonnes of a fern like plant growing which is killing off the grass, anyway, the young lad at the yard who keeps the pigs and chickens said to me this morning, 'oh I wouldnt worry about killing the weeds just keep letting them grow and the grass will grow inbetween' now he's got his BHS 1 qualification so had done land management. I responded that it needed doing and it's my pony thats there so i'm going to do it. I occured to me afterwards that he doesnt want any new people to come with horses and at present everyone knows the land to be very poor and not good for the horses, if i improved the land, then the other 2 empty stales might be rented, which he doesnt want. So even though he knows land management, his attitude isnt really for the animals, just what he wants. sad really!
ridrapeau whilst your grazing with him, when he comes close and pick some grass whilst you're bent over, then putting your hand under the fence without standing up off ehat you have in your hand to him, dont look at him, just look at the grass in your hand, as soon as he takes it take your hand away. Graze a bit more and remember don't turn your back to him, move a few feet away from him, then slowly go back next to him, do the same agaain and give hime some grass whoist still looking like you are grazing, this time after he takes it, stroke him between the eyes. Do this one more time move away, go back and offer. After the third time start grazing (weeding :) ) little further off, try not to stand up to often. Do this for a couple of days and then start to stroke him when standing up. I found it important to imitae the grazing, it's saying I'm happy to eat with you. Because you offer the grass from the ground whilst you are grazing, it's not like you are giving him a treat, but just sharing what you have so he wont view it like hand feeding a carrott. Keep doing this for a week, you'll even find that he will start to graze around your hand and let you graze around his area without any problems. Will look out to see how you get on ;)
Have a good weekend everyone. x
sorry about all the typos, i'm on the ipad and it doesnt always function as i want it lol
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