Having been hurt by falls a few times, I would suggest you start out slowly, get use to riding at a walk before easing into a trot, and so on, getting comfortable at each stage before moving onto the next one. As for myself, I wouldnt give up on riding or the horse, you are right that a different horse wouldnt make a difference, but maybe you could get used to riding a well trained horse first just to get the feel. You CAN get back the relationship you had with this horse with time and patience.

Don't give in to your fear, you will always regret it. I would suggest deep breathing exercises. Belly breathing will help you to bring your heart rate and adrenaline down. I used this technique when I was asked to be the organist in my church. I was scared to death to sit up there and play, my hands were shaking I couldn't concentrate. So I put into practice Monty's theory of deep breathing, I could feel instantly my heart rate come down and I felt more calm. I'm still nervous when I play but it's getting easier each time. You will not overcome your fear overnight but take it slowly, just sit on the horse for a minute and then dismount. Do this several times until you become comfortable with that, then walk with the horse and so on. I believe you can overcome your fear, but you must believe that you can and not let it defeat you.
Good luck,
Kleinne

When we feel fear after an experience like you describe, I think survival is at stake.
Just like horses when confronted with something that left a bad memory.
What do we do to get rid of the bad memory? We try to replace it with a good one!
I suggest you desensitize yourself, maybe with the help of another, very patient, person and confront your fear in a way that helps you rewrite the scenario. Your helper should let you choose the pace and the speed that suits you, not try to force things on you.
The relatioship with your young horse can be repaired, you need to feel secure and help him see value in your being his leader again. As you said, you can do Join-up to settle this.
The first time I got back into the saddle after a year's break due to an accident, I asked a gentle friend to lead the horse with me as a passenger. Slowly I took over and within 3 sessions we were riding out again. The horse (not the one I had the accident with!) behaved like a concerned parent, sensing I needed her support.
Take your time, don't rush things.
Most of all accept your own fear, it is a natural reaction, only when you accept it, you can work your way out of it! You'll make it....
Keep us posted,
Miriam

Thanks for the kind comments... I have to add I am a so called Expert in meditation practices but, as Miriam said, this kind of experiences are imprinted into us as life-threatening.
To be precise they are printed into Amigdala which is a small gland we have in our central nervous system responsible for the storage of all experiences, some are genetically printed such as the fear for ferocious animals or snakes and some come from experiences. Amigdala has a direct connection with brain and commands it to do what necessary for the survival, this is why we can reach so fast to threatening situations.... I knew about this but I did not realize the fact my Amigdala could overwrite my good experiences in riding labeling horse riding as a life threatening practice at the point my legs were not cooperating when I wanted to mount the horse.
Now I have to start all over again, as correctly suggested allow someone to lead me while getting reacquainted with riding again. I will not give up, I have to do it for the horse who has shown a great patience (imagine it has taken one good minute from the moment I have put a foot in the stirrup and the moment I have actually sit on the saddle) and has not given me anything alse than what I asked him to do.
I will keep posted on this link my return to riding, funny enough was now looking at some pictures of myself playing full speed on a horse.... and now I am scared of trotting.... really painful for someone who has put horses as his balance point, riding was for me the safe place to retreat when things were not going well, I then was saying to myself "at least You are good in riding".....

Miriam makes an interesting point about a bad experience causing a survival instinct. You could look at this as a great learning experience in better understanding how an abused horse feels when coming into contact with a human. Their fear takes over and only a gentle, slow, kind hand can heal the trauma and replace it with confidence. Empathy...not a bad thing to experience when dealing with a traumatized horse. I know that's not the case with your horse but there are so many abused horses out there that need someone to care enough to give them a chance. You now have a unique understanding of what they're going through. You might apply Monty's principles to yourself if they work for the horse, they might just work for you.

good point also, thanks for the suggestion.

diary conitinues.... yesterday went to move my Horse after some days, he is at the moment in a friend place as I am revamoing his paddock, I brought him to the round pen, turned to close the gate and suddenly he un off... with the leading rope attached the the halter... run for a small while, roll over the floor for a couple of times and the when he was more quiet I approach him, unclip the leading rope and since the place he stopped was nearly at 2 hr. position sent him away for a joinup... he ha started galopping kicking in the air bolting, after 5 rounds I wanted him to change direction but he just started running faster, so I waited some rounds and then was able to making him change direction, some rounds again and when I have seen him more quiet I have approached him, led him around for a while and then brought him back to the stable.
When led he walks behind me, but a little too pushy... so I send him back a little and when stays at convenient distance we start walking again.
I am happy has I have regained toncertain extent a leading role... despite I did not get a joinup as before with clear 4 signs but a state of quietness where Horse stands still, lower the head and allows me to touch him everywhere.
today he will come home and new SADDLE will arrive in a couple of days, then I will /try to mount him again and se how it goes.

It sounds as if you missed a good opportunity to do a good join-up when he was so lively initially. Once you changed his direction I would have then kept him going until you got the four signs then tried join up. Seems like a missed opportunity to me so try it next time. Has his diet changed? He maybe just getting more grass at your friends place hence feeling really good.

Yes, You are right but I wanted to stay in the five rounds as specified by Monty, to me was important to get him more quiet as we already achieved some good join-up (2) in previous occasions.
Now Xerez has come back home and started to be bully as usual...when enter his paddock trots towards me shoulder straight and looking at me in the eyes... i do the same and so it looks like in those western movies when the two gunmen are facing each other to see who is faster in shooting. Usually I am and Xerez runs away.... once done that he usually runs up and down in the paddock kicking in the aira and then snorting and putting his head on the ground puffing. I still have to understand how to interpret it, I mean consider it just a test to see how I react or do I have to get it more seriously and chase him in a corner of the paddock and keep him there to show who's the boss?

eponti01 When he does this in the paddock rather than just square up to him actually move in and send him away from you with your arms. If he has done a couple of successful join ups he should now be ready to join up with you in the paddock. So send him out and keep on sending him on until you get some or all of the four signs and smaller circles and then turn and ask him to join up. Big reward of course when he does come to you and keep those eyes averted. This way you are gaining his respect and next time you go into the paddock keep your eyes down and turn your shoulder to him and see if he will come to you submissively. If he doesn't then square up on him again and send him off. Currently he is just having fun with you and he may even be a little afraid of you given he is snorting etc. You need to get the upper hand here and chasing him into a corner and keeping him there to show him who's boss is not the answer - it will just make him more worried about you. You need a partnership relationship not you as boss and join up will give you this. Just stay patient and keep on sending him on in the paddock until he is willing to join up with you. Good luck!

Yes, maybe the matter was going out of hand.... first I have made peace with him, yesterday I have entered the paddock, just sent him away when trying to bully me and not allow him to go away from a certain area of the paddock... I have then approached him, rewarded him and turned my back...he has followed me for a while and then allow me to touch him, put him the halter, lace him with the leading rope, stay still for a little while, lower the head when asked and even to spray him with mosquito spray (he hates it!!, not to mention touching him in the sensitive point of the body.
This morning when I have gone to clean his paddock no sign of aggressivity ...on both sides :-))
Situation appears as You pointed out... we were both worried about each other and trying to show reciprocal power!! once broken this emotional loop situation, by changing my attitude (of course his always the man in the mirror who has to review something...)sitaution has suddenly turned to a good and mutually respectful relationship. Now I am trying to understand how we got to this situation, of course it has been something wrong on my side as he knows his language whereas I am a beginner and maybe I have spoken some blasphemy while trying to say something gentle!!
I think there are two main error I made, being too pushy in sending him away while joining up... to be effective I was shouting to him and maybe that has brought fear in him who acting defensively has brought fear in me who than have acted aggressively....
This evening will try to be more gentle in the joinup and patient enought to achieve a full joinup, tomorrow my american saddle will arrive and then I will try to ride him for a short time.
Lesson learned: Leadership does not mean be too aggressive..

Good for you, it sounds like you're figuring it out. I think we all have to learn this lesson and once we do our relationships with our horses gets so much better. You'll find your horse will be your best teacher, he'll make sure you know what you're doing right and what you're doing wrong.
Keep up the good work!

...saddle arrived but no good results yet.. Xerez does not like to be tied up (to a tree as he leaves in a paddock with some trees and there is no wall or strong structure where I can tie him) so I barely managed to saddle him, but thati is not good as he was continuously moving while I was trying to tack him up.
I do believe I have to proceed step by step and before riding him be able to achieve the standing still level, while saddling and bridling him and then when I will mount him. Is it a correct approach?

Do you have a dually halter? Watch the Monty videos on standing still, I have found them very helpful in all ways. Yes, he definately needs to learn to stand still for everything before you try to get on him.

I don't have the dually halter, I am trying to do without.... I understand it ill take some more effort on both sides but I am confident to be able to achieve decent results anyway.

eponti01 - without the dually halter you cannot possibly teach Monty's methods. It is an essential piece of equipment for a young horse or any horse in training so do try to invest in one. They are available from the Uni shop. You will not get good results otherwise. I would never be without one now as they save so much hassle.

yap, i was infact about to purchase one but got tangled with shipping and custom duties costs, I am thus asking a colleague of mine to bring on for me, but it will take some more days and I have to keep the horse under training.....

I just got mine recently and it has worked wonders with both of our horses. I would definately recomend it. I thought I couldnt afford it, but now realize I couldnt afford to be without it.

todays motto is ....what did I do wrong! or .. holy moly I am destroying my horse confidence instead of building it! in brief today everything went wrong.... disaster attempt to join up in a paddock with some grass ( not much really), horse freaks out when trying to put saddle pad on his back, horse does not stay still when trying to put him cream.... yesterday was like a statue, today a wild horse in disguise..... what did I do wrong? it is very frustrating because I just repeated the same procedure as some other days, but response has been very very different. I started feeling very bad and very violent thoughts were coming to my mind.... I cannot spend any money on training a horse who acts perfect with instructsor and becomes naughty with me, myself also not excellent results with other horxes but not with my own..... is it possible there is not feeling between meand this Horse? I am very very frustrated and lost all confidence in myself and in the way I can communicate with my horse.

Something you need to realize is that everyone has bad days where they feel like everything has gone wrong. It is just one day and is now behind you. Remember your horse is your best teacher, he will teach you everything you need to know about how to deal with him. You must remind yourself that you are HIS student and that if you aren't humble and teachable this will be a longer process. He will show you his worst and most intense fears first, these are the things that he needs the most support and understanding for. Anger and frustration will only support his fears not help him conquer them. He is testing you to see if he can trust you, so you need to ask yourself, "Can he trust me?". It took me 3 years to turn my horse from a neurotic mess into the kind of horse I could put my daughter on and know she would be taken care of. I had many days when I wanted to beat that horse into submission, however, it was only when I learned to control my temper and always put his needs first that things began to change, mostly for me. He could finally trust me and together we helped each other. Don't give up you can do this, one fear at a time and give him as much time as he needs to deal with it.

eponti01 - ditto to klienne. We all have our days and our horses have theirs so put it behind you now. Everything you mentioned that is going wrong can be corrected once you have the dually. I would be inclined to give your horse and yourself a little break from training until you have your dually halter. Try to end on a good note first though so go out in a positive frame of mind with some determination to keep your adrenaline down. Maybe just sit in his paddock for awhile and see if he comes up to you. If he does then give him a good rub down - end of lesson for the day. Try it again the next day - maybe halter him and lead him around a bit. Keep it all really low key. Once the dually arrives then start training him with it but still keep it low key and slow.

thx, I will do it.

Hi eponti,
From the way this thread has developed, I suggest you look for a Certified Instructor in your country and let her/him help you find the best way to approach your horse. Remember that anger is often fear in disguise, both feelings do influence the way your horse senses you.
Not only breathing and adrenalin are concerned, it's also eyemovements and muscle-tension that shows the horse you feel threatened. Horses synchronize, so he mirrors your state of mind.
Starting at zero and building up from there seems a very good idea, you'll be surprised how quick things turn around for you!
Miriam

Thanks, I have already thought to do so... I will contact one asap.

I hope that you can overcome your fear. Just when you are scared try to remember why you loved horses in the first place. =)
I fell off a horse a few months ago for the first time in my life. was supposed to do another flying lead change, but I lost my stirrup as I was coming into one of the turns. The horse (Jessie) was doing everything she could to keep me balanced, but it was too late. I hit the ground and got slammed into the metal fence rail.
The next thing I saw was Jessie standing over me. At first I was scared and thought please don't hurt me. I was crying and I was in too much pain to move. Then Jessie put her nose in my hand that is when I wasn't scared anymore and I loved her. My hip was dislocated, my ankle was broken,all the muscles and tendons in my leg were messed up, I had whiplash, and a concussion, but for a few seconds I forgot all about it. I knew I wanted to be back in the saddle. Even when I had to have my hip put back in place right there in the arena and was screaming at the top of my lungs having a horse stay with me made it better. The last image in my head I have of Jessie was her head hung low walking away.
I guess I want to go back so I can tell her it wasn't her fault and to show her I'm getting better. The only thing that gives me confidence is my love for the horse. That is how I know I will get back on. =). Don't give up I know you can do this.

Eponti

All through this thread I can feel your panic and fear; it is almost at the point of hysteria. Your desire to overcome your fear as fast as possible is getting in the way of you actually doing just that. I am also concerned that you are considering riding this horse at all - I don't think you should at the moment. You don't trust each other, the horse is acting as your mirror and behaving just as you are - afraid, panicking, insecure, and not able to trust. This might sound as if I am being very critical - I truly am not. I have very deep sympathy for you, it has taken me 4o years to get over my terror of horses, and I would love to be the one to be there supporting you to get through this but as i am on the othr side of the world it's a bit difficult!. I am challenging your perceptions because you (a) clearly are willing to explore your own self (b) have an understanding of psychlogy and meditation so are familiar with the concepts of panic and fear being the blindfold that stops us seeing clearly. I do not feel you are being fair to this horse at the moment, you MUST slow down - everything seems to be rushing and has to be NOW. Why can you not wait for the Dually to arrive? Why do you have to get on this horse? Why is it a power struggle? On practical matters (1) I am a little muddled, when my horse trots up to me in the field I am delighted that he is so keen to come to me, and he stops just in front of me - what is it that he is doing that you interpret as bullying and the need to send him away- why do you need to square up to him? I'm sorry, I'm just not understanding this bit - my fault not yours, I need more explanation! (2) Before you teach your horse to be saddled he must learn to stand still whenever you need him to without being tied up. Looking for stronger things to tie him to is very very dangerous; Monty does NOT tie horses up to be saddled, he says it is a very dangerous thing to do. You say you are willing to go back to the beginning. I think the beginning is further back than where you are. The beginning is walking into the field, going to do soemthing else, ignore the horse, walk out. Do this 6 times a day and he might start to trust you. "Doing Join Up" (as I'm sure everyone is sick of hearing me say now!) is NOT aa task to be fulfilled it is about building a realtionship. Go and meditate in the field! As for getting over your fear of riding, find a very very safe horse that does not move an inch, have a freind hold him, get on him, sit there, do nothing, breathe until your heart rate and breathing come down to normal, get off, go home. That is day 1. Build from there. It is hard to convey care in written form but I assure you I care a lot about what you are going through and I wish you great success.

Iamforgiven, what a beautiful relationship you have with your house, I hope you are soon better and back together again

House???? What a typing error, that of course should say Horse!!

Dear Eponit01
Please be gentle with yourself. The loudest voice in our head is our own judge. I can understand d the pressure you may feel having had so many horse driven vacations and now country lifestyle that you feel frustrated that you are back at step one. As Vicci said please slow down, for your sake and your horse. I often tell my art students that slower is really faster, as you will not have to go back and undo mistakes made in haste. There is no prize or trophy for getting there faster. You may want to read Joe Camp 's book Soul of a Horse. It was helpful for me to see the value of pasture time. Breathe and find your peace first. Your horse will know and respond accordingly.
paula

Thank you so much for the comment Vicci. I think you give such great advice and everyone is so sweet and truly loves horses. I'm so glad I joined this website. I spell things wrong too so it's ok. =)
Unfortunately, Jessie isn't my horse. I just met her the week before the accident and rode her once.
I am healing up too and things look good. My Cerebral Palsy is making my recovery take a little longer, but as soon as I get out of the stretching cast I will hopefully get the ok.
My horse is a chestnut paint miniature horse named Ivy May. She and I have a lot of problems because as a kid I was taught "train her this way to win ribbons." So now I'm at square one learning how to get the true relationship I always wanted with her.
Right now I'm trying to get her to join up with me. She won't go forward but rather plant her feet and eat the grass. (I don't have a round pen and the pen I do have is not flat)
If she does go forward it is a slow lazy walk and she will continue to eat the grass. Other times she will just turn and face me. The other thing she will do is take off at a gallop and not stop bucking and kicking. I never know what side I will get, but most of the time it is eat the grass.
A lot of people have tried to help me. Some have used a whip, lead rope, others told me to put something over her mouth to keep her from eating. What do I need to do because it seems like everything I try to do Ivy finds a way to get out of it.
She leads well with me and will move through her gaits just fine and I can't just let her eat because she founders so easy.

I hope make a full recovery iamforgiveneph17.

Thanks Horse addict I love your photo. =)

Vicci and all,really good advice given. I have been though a confidence crisis recently after a fall and am delighted to be putting it behind me now. Having read Kellys book, Perfect Confidence, other related books and very importantly giving myself time things are much better. We are so keen to get going, especially with young horses as we want to get them going and bring them on therefore putting immense pressure on ourselves. I resorted to riding my friends horse who is real easy going and building up bit by bit. One also needs to regain a certain level of riding fitness as well in order to feel more confident and ride better especially on young horses who are more likely to spook or have a bit of fun. The most important thing is try to keep each experience positive especially when in the saddle, so start riding and easy horse whilst doing short session of ground work with your horse, even just simply leading and going for a walk. I go jogging with my 2 boys now, one at a time ofcourse;) and do my dually schooling along the way and it has really helped with our confidence in each other. I also get to keep fit too: )whenever we pass something I think they may find scary I act really confident and walk right on by with strong intention not focusing on the scary object so they can gain confidence in me as their leader and it really helps and should also translate into your riding later. Eponit01, I totally sympathize but don't pressurize yourself too much. Just take it bit by bit and it will be fine. 8 months ago I was scared to even do ground work with my 4 year old let alone get on his back. Now I have just re backed him and we are hacking out and things are going great. Try simple exercises until you find things you can be successful at and then you will both feel great. I tried the mounting block one from the online uni and it was a huge leap for me. After 3 sessions my boy went from being impossible to mount to doing it exactly like on the video. The achievement was a huge boost for me and the horse. Sorry for rambling on but I know what you are going through so hope there are some helpful tips in there. Hang in there and good luck!