I really need advice. Monty's methods saved my mare, she was classed as dangerous, vicious, uncontrollable etc she was destined for the slaughter house when I rescued her, she is a completely different mare now, I love her more than anything in the world and will never be parted from her, but now I have a new difficulty. A friend of mine who is a complete novice fell in love with a mare who is 7 yrs old, there is no question of sale even if she ends up as a companion. She has been vet checked and has no physical problems. However she is a bit of a little monster. She is 14.2 cob type very well put together and very strong. She was raised by a man from 7 months old as a pet, she travelled in his boot, walked around on his shoulders, in his house etc, and generally behaved like a human. She was sent away to be broken at 5 I have no details on this. I believe she has a tiny tinŷ understanding of parelli. She was then left for 2 years in a field with no human contact just 2 geldings that she dominates.
While her owner never meant any harm I personally think that treating her as human is behind some of her issues the advice I need is how to deal with her safely. Everyone I have asked says shoot her or sell her or beat her till she is scared, they are not options for me.
When she is doing as she wants she is sweetness itself, loving, friendly, gentle, she enjoys human company, when she is not getting her own way or wants something she isn't getting she gets aggressive. I have a feeling she has found this was the way to get what she wanted in the past. Which when she was a goal may have been cute, now she is deadly!
She bites, head butts, kicks with front and back feet, charges, pushes, bulldozes and bronks the only thing she has yet to do is rear.
Of course this makes her dangerous and not suitable for my friend, I offered to help, I started with join up, with dually work, having her move her feet not mine, lunging, long lining.
Everything goes perfectly until she decides she does not want to do it, then it's get the hell our of the way or head to hospital she works through her repertoire until she finds an option that gets her what she wants, I have persevered as much as I can but the injuries are getting serious.
Also she doesn't forget, if anyone has asked something of her that she didn't like and she didn't get to hurt them if that person comes near her later and is off guard she will kick or bite.
Please help, all advice is greatly appreciated, I don't believe that she is an impossible case there is no such thing I just have to work out what I am doing wrong so that I can correct it and build a relationship with her.
Hi Karen - I could write you chapter and verse about how, why, what, and when to 'do' allsorts BUT I think the kindest thing you can do for your friend is tell her to walk away from this horse. This is NOT one for a novice.
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I read a saying on here once (can't remember who said it!) "Green and green make black and blue" i.e. novice horse (which she is in terms of manners) + novice owner = injury.
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There are thousands of horses out there looking for loving owners; this horse needs gentle, and VERY experienced hands. Your friend deserves something safe to start with - she can learn with a project horse later on.
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I know I sound blunt but the risks are too high. I totally agree with you that it is not impossible but it has to be the right set up. I also agree that she has been over humanised which is a BIG problem. You have done wonders with your mare, but don't risk this.
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It is of course your decision and if you decide to continue I know you will get all the support available but please think carefully about what you ask of yourself, your friend, and the horse.
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Good luck.
I agree Karen, this horse isn't a remedial case she sounds downright dangerous and needs complete rehabilitation, definitely not for a novice to try.
Karen , while I understand your desire to help I Encourage you to understand that the language of Equus is disconnected in horses who have been hand raised... They re a different "breed" and I suggest that your seek someone with that level of experience to deal with this horse to ensure safety. sometimes we need to change our expectations of the horse to meet them at their needs and not ours... This may never be the ideal situation but it's the management of expectations that will help maintain a safe and productive environment.
Hi Karen. I add my support to what has already been posted. This cob is a job for a professional trainer. Not necessarily one who uses harsh methods but one who knows how to cope without getting hurt - or hurting the cob either. Your friend has 2.choices, walk away or get professional help. Cheers, Jo.
Hi Karen, I seen a film documentery called "Buck" it follows his clinics in the US and there is a horse owned by a woman very similar to this, she has brought it up in her house, the mum died whilst giving birth. I think we all know that orphans are a bit different to deal with, the horse was extremely dangerous and Buck basically told her to have it put to sleep which he has never told anyone in probably 40 years of doing his clinics, you see the horse attack his right hand man, he gets away but not without a bad head injury from a bite that needed stitches. I'd recommend you watch it, I know this is a Monty forum but I'm sure he wouldn't mind me posting this as Buck Brannaman is a excelleny horseman and it's just to let you see this and what he does to try and get this horse back into the trailer and explain to the others at the clinic about the situation and about the horse.
Please be careful and do seek help from an expert, I was hurt myself in December as my horse is very spooky and I didn't notice the long line had wrapped round my boot when he spooked, completely my own fault but it made me lose my confidence completely at the time and even now I am still struggling emotionally as well as physically.
Thank you so much for your comments everyone :) Mary I feel for you, there is nothing worse than losing confidence, it happened to me once, and mine wasnt even over a serious incident, just something in my brain decided being near anything larger than me was a bad idea, it took a good long time to get past even fighting it every day. I really hope you get there and will keep my fingers crossed you do. I have downloaded documentary to watch.
I completely agree with the advice everyone has posted, I just hate giving up on her, especially when I know how difficult it will be for my friend, she is currently riding my school master who is good as gold, and is teaching her more than she realises. I sat down and had a long chat with her today. I explained that I was worried, that I didnt even feel this mare is safe on the yard or in the field, let alone when being asked to do something. I read your responses to her, she is of course very upset, she loves this mare dearly, spends hours every day talking to her, stroking her over the door to her stable, she is going to take some time to think about it all, I have told her I will work with a trainer if she decides to go that route but that I am not comfortable doing it without professional help and that I dont think she will ever be suitable for her to ride. I set the expectation that she may never be more than "managed" to keep everyone safe.
THank you all so much you have no idea how much you helped me have this conversation with her. xx
Thank you Karen, I'm getting there slowly, although when he jumps now, I jump, I've gotten so nervous of him landing on me but I'm going to get past it, there's good people at my yard that'll help me bring him in/out for safety so I am lucky to have supportive people around and not the know it alls that would probably think "what the hells she doing" so that helps.
You'll know exactly what horse it is when you watch the doc (the woman has something like 18 stallions at home) she's not hard to miss and the horse you'll defo notice!
I think I speak for the majority of horse lovers that we don't want to give up on any horse but I think your friend or someone else is going to get badly hurt or worse and then she'll be inconsolible that she let it go on, we must all stay safe first and foremost.
If you haven't seen Clint Andersons work, maybe have a look at what he does as I've seen him do some very out of control horses like this also, he is Australian but based in the US, another great horseman at the top of his game imo, you can see a few videos on youtube or go to downunderhorsemanship.com. This is the only thing I know that can maybe help before doing the drastic, I hope you can both help this horse but if you are in the US maybe you could call one of these guys up or email and explain what the situation is with the horse, I mean no harm in trying and Buck will certainly be honest and his clinics are far cheaper than most and he is a genuine lovely man.
I wish you the best of luck and hope that this can be a successful story but I do realise it depends on mainly funds available and where your located, I'm praying you get some advice and help xx
Karen - I'm really glad you were able to work through this, I wish you and your friend all the luck in the world on this journey :-)
Mary - I hope things get better for you soon.
Thank you Vicci, things are improving now with my confidence so I'm going to do what I can then get him sent up to a great trainer to have him started when I can afford to, she's done the course with Kelly Marks and is a lovely girl so he will be in good hands, I'll really have to start a new thread on Apollo's progress at some point.
I am sorry to see you are leaving for a bit, I enjoyed reading your posts, I hope to see you back later in the year, take care and enjoy your animals x
Just re-joined the uni. So sorry to read of your set back with Apollo, Mary. Sounds as if you have found a great trainer to start him so that is exciting. All the very best from now on. Karen like Mary you have had such success with your mare it doesn't seem very wise to jeopardise your own safety and your future with your horses by helping out with this confused and spoilt mare. Totally agree with all the comments from other members that you have received here. She really does need a very experienced person to handle her and even they may need to give up on her. I think even Monty would agree that there are some impossible cases and she seems to be one. Just stay safe and keep away from her and hopefully your friend will either walk away too or get expert professional help as Jo suggested.