Gen
Congratulations on your new foal. It is too bad that mom is overly protective, otherwise you could start to "imprint" the foal" . What you really are doing is desensitizing the foal to human contact, clippers, handling the feet etc.
If the mare is that protective you need to proceed with the upmost caution so you do not get injured. I am assuming that the foal has had a bowel movement since he was born. If o you do not need to worry about the foal too much. Mom on the other hand needs to calm down so you can at least go into the paddock with her and the foal. There are a number of herbal supplements for calming mares down and I would start giving her that supplement as well as making sure that she is getting enough quality food.
Here is a website that has most of the quality supplements for mares
http://www.valleyvet.com/catalog_products/equine_supplies/horse_supplements/calming_agents.html
We use Quiessence on our horses that get too nervous or cranky. It takes awhile to become effective but works great.

The only other thing that I can suggest is to make sure that you have contact with the foal, visually or physically, everyday so the the foal gets use to your present. I would not push mom too much. She is running on instinct and elevated hormones and needs to be left alone for awhile.

Cheers

Hi Gen,
Congratulations! The most important thing is that your foal was born healthy, is on his feet, drinks the colostrum (that is only produced in this short period after birth) and starts exploring his surroundings. Since the mare is under the influence of hormonal changes right now, I'd leave the 2 of them alone, let her find her balance (with the help of some supplements as Dennis suggested) and don't worry about the imprinting. Most horses you meet around the world have not been imprinted, I understand your disappointment, it would have been great, but you'll get your chance to build a relationship with him. I would not do Join-up with the mare until he's weaned and she's used to the absence of him. Neither would I start too early with the foal. Try to avoid any stress for mother and foal, so she won't have to "protect" him from you, for the time being.
Use his curiousity when he's a little bit older to start touching him, preferably every day, so he gets a routine of physical contact with humans.
Try to enjoy these precious first days, the mare will probably relax if you do.
Miriam

Hi Dennis and Miriam
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Thanks for getting back to me. The foal is beautiful. He is a Chestnut (Sorrel) Roan Sabino Paint.
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He has had a bowel movement, he has urinated and suckled. The one really good thing Dazzler (mom) did was put herself into our large round yard which has a stall off to one side of it. I have left the gate opened between her paddock and this yard because she had no other shelter. I saw the foal's bowel movement on the ground in the yard and a small wet patch of dirt near by. So that's good. We have shut them in for now because there are some wild dogs hanging around our area. This round yard and stall is dog-proof, so she chose a great spot to give birth.
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He is up and about, even tired a little lope around his mom yesterday afternoon :-)
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Thanks Dennis for suggesting the Herbal Suppliments. I am a great believer in those and I am pretty sure the Saddlery in town has Quiessence. I have definately heard of it before and will get some. Will also check out that site - thank you very much.
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She has a constant supply of good quality hay and I give her a hard feed every night with a product called Breeda in it which we have found very good. Its balanced for vitamins and minerals and you can use some Herbal Suppliments with it.
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Thanks for your encouragement Miraim. My husband and I have been observing the mare and foal from a distance so as not to cause her any stress. We can sit in our shed and see them and they can't see us - which is great :-)
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We have only gone into the yard to clean up poo, put out feed and put water in the troughs. They were both in the stall this morning when I went to clean the yard, so I actually shut them both in while I cleaned out the yard and Dazzler seemed quite happy with that. We will have to clean the yard daily, so that will let the foal see us and get used to our presence. As Dazzler gets more comfortable, I will hang out where I am visible for a bit longer.
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I am really enjoying watching them together :-) When I do have to go to the yard, I remain calm and act normal, so hopefully my lowered adrenaline will rub off on Dazzler. I don't go down by myself, I get my Husband to come with me just in case I need him and to mitigate the level of risk posed to me by my very protective mare.
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Thank you both so much for your help, your advice has given me some direction with which to move forward. Thank you again.
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Kindest regards,
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Gen

Congratulations to your foal, Gen! Isn't it just a marvelous thing, watching them?
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I completely agree with Miriam and Dennis about leaving the mare alone as she runs on hormones now. Once the little guy gets more curious of his surroundings, I'm sure he will seek you out. Sooner or later, when Dazzler is convinced you're not harming him, she will probably be happy to get some alone time because boys will be boys and their mom's get tired pretty son of that. ;)
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Just adding to Dennis and Miriam's excellent advices that while herbal supplements are great, just be careful with anything you give your mare as it will also affect the foal by way of the milk.
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Make sure you enjoy these first months when so many things happens!

Hi Kicki
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Thank you :-) and yes, they are just so wonderful to watch. I didn't get much work done over the weekend because I was sitting in the shed watching them in the yard! I am just amazed at how quickly the little fellow has worked out how to use his legs. He's a bit wobbly from time to time, but he is trying to jump and is taking a few loping steps around his mom. Just beautiful :-)
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When we go to the yard where they are, the little colt looks at us and takes a few steps toward us, but Dazzler moves him away. So, I think you are right in that he will seek us out eventually.
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I have been giving my camera a work out too. Thankfully it has a long distance lense so I can zoom in without being noticed ;-)
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I have a telephone appointment with an Equine Herbalist today on the herbal suppliments. I also have to make sure I can feed it with the Breeda pellets. Or I may have to change the feed completely - depends on the advice I get.
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Thanks again everyone for your help.
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Kind regards,
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Gen

Oh Gen! This is wonderful and I can share your joy at your new arrival. It is so much fun to have a foal to handle and watch grow. I have only had Tricka so I am not experienced but she has given me so much joy. My Pie was a very scared, abused horse who had learnt to really fight back. I guess she trusted me by the time she had Tricka as she had been with me for 10 years by then but many friends told me to expect the worst once she had a foal and that I was crazy to breed from her. My experience was so different to yours so I was very lucky. Pie was also overdue and one day I was just about to go out when I saw her staggering down to the menage and then lie down. Wow! I knew her time had come and I should have just let her get on with it but I couldn't help myself I had to go up close enough to watch. After awhile the foals feet and nose were just poking out and Pie was acting a bit stressed. I had pulled many calves so I couldn't resist the temptation to help out so I went over and gently pulled the little hooves and out came Tricka still in her birth bag and very still. I thought she was still born until I broke the birth bag to take a closer look and she immediately started moving and with my help she was soon on her wobbly legs. I didn't know about foal imprinting at the time but I guess I imprinted her without realizing I had. Pie was still on the ground but soon got up too and I knew to step away immediately so that she could start mothering. Pie cleaned Tricka up and Tricka started trying to canter around her. The foal hadn't sucked after an hour or so and it was quiet hot so I started trying to help her find the udder and to my amazemtne Pie was so gentle with us both and totally accepted my involvement. I guess she had known I had helped her out of her pain. Instead of having a vicious cranky mother Pie totally changed to a very placid accepting horse which was so amazing. So the hormones made her a different horse so hopefully in time they will kick in with your mare too but the herbal calmers sound like a good idea. Others are more experienced than me so will undoubtedly have better advice. It would be good if you could gain your foals trust and start handling him at an early age but it will be so hard if the mare resents your interference. I realise now how lucky I was as I could just go up and play with Tricka whenever I liked and Pie just welcomed me. Pie watched placidly while I rubbed Tricka all over, taught her to halter lead and later lunge etc. I just don't know what I would do if I was in your situation. A situation my horse experienced friends promised me I would have with Pie. All I can say is good luck and stay safe. I would really work on trying to gain the mare's acceptance of you so that you can handle her foal safely. Yeh! I know that is easy to say but hard to do!! Regardless - have fun and enjoy this special experience.

Hi Maggie
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Thank you so much for your post :-) I am so glad you had Pie for so long and that she trusts you the way she does. I just went down to see how the mare and foal were going and Dazzler took a couple of friendly steps towards me with ears forward - so that's a step in the right direction. I just stood at the fence and looked.
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Safety and not stressing Dazzler out so that the foal gets the wrong impression are my top priorities...
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I am so glad you got to see Pie give birth and share that experience with her. I missed it completely! I was looking for all the signs like waxing on the teats etc and there were none that I could see. We just woke up to a surpirse!
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I also hope no one else finds themselves in this situation. Not a lot of things can make me cry, but the dissapointment I felt with this situation brought me pretty close. I was very upset. Am feeling a lot better now though with the advice and support I have been given here.
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Our second foal is due on Boxing Day this year, so maybe I will have better luck next time :-)
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Thanks again Maggie :-)
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Kind regards,
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Gen

Hi Gen,
Your situation has improved, as I hoped it would, maybe you can start touching the Mom at the shoulder, ignoring the foal, and then go away (approach and retreat!) repeat this several times and leave her alone for the day. Next day try to touch more, probably the foal will "hide" behind the Mom and at some point take one step in your direction. Remember that preditors never touch and then go away, so the going-away-part is the most important one. As long as you'll not separate Mom and foal she might accept you, since you seem not interested in her baby. Start stroking her at the spot where horses groom eachother, just at the top of the shoulderblade near the whithers. Let the foal seek you, don't touch it and wait for Mom's approval, it'll come with time!
Miriam

I have the same attitude as Miriam. I am contacting the mom first. When she trusts me, then I start approaching the foal. All with the Equus language you use for Join-Up (without sending the horse away). Until now there was no aggressive behaviour of a mare. The horses I know are very socialized and have a large experience with human contacts, this may be the difference. But I am always very careful, especially when there are several mares and foals together.

Hi Miriam
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Thanks for the advice, I will give this a go this afternoon when I go down to clean the yard and feed her. When Dazzler took the steps towards me yesterday, I turned away so as not to look her in the eye and put my arm across my body with shoulders down in an attempt to implement what I understand about Equus. She came a bit closer to me this morning when I went down, and I did the same thing with my body. I moved forward again when she looked away.
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Thank you very much for your advice. Its greatly appreciated.
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Hi Rudi
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Good to hear from you :-) Yes, that's right, Dazzler has never been agressive towards me before. She has been nervous around us, but I have spent a lot of time grooming and touching her during her pregnancy in an attempt to build a bit of trust between us because I had a feeling this situation may arise, but didn't think it would be so bad.
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I will progress as you guys suggest and let you know how I go.
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Thank you again,
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Kind regards,
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Gen

Gen
Glad things are progressing for you. My only comment is that your mare is a good mom and was protecting her foal at the foals most vulnerable time. It was her instinct to protect and not an intensionally aggressive act. You don't need t be afraid of her and actually I would not act any different around her that before she had the foal.
Your mare is use to a certain behavior from you in the why you approached her rubbed her and fed her. If you change that behavior too much it will be confusing to her.

I know you will be successful and the foal will be you friend shortly. Calmness works wonders

Cheers

SUCCESS!!
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Hi all, just wanted to let you know that I spent a bit more time using the advance/retreat techniques this afternoon and got to touch Dazzler on the shoulders. I gave her a good scratch until she licked and chewed and then I left.
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Yay!
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Such a relief, and thank you so much for helping me out here everyone.
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Yes, Dennis you are quite right, Dazzler is a great mom. But WOW, her actions were very fierce to say the least. I was expecting protectiveness from her, but not to the extent of what she did - that's for sure. I had to work double time to keep my heart rate under control and act normal... And I really didn't know what to do, so I came here to the Forum.
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This experience and everyone's advice will make me better prepared for next time :-)
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I have always had to be careful around her - like really make an effort to be calm because she is so nervous. I was seriously worried that I would never get near her again after seeing how she reacted with her new baby.
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Thanks for your encouragement, it really means a lot.
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Kind regards,
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Gen

I'm so happy for your success, Gen!
Congratulations for having the patience and calm to wait her out.
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Under the circumstances, I wonder if you shouldn't be happy that you missed out on the birth? Maybe your eagerness to imprint the foal would have triggered Dazzler's instincts in a way that might've harmed both you and her baby - however unintentionally.

Hi Gen,

What wonderfull to have the little fellow.

I was trying to see the whole situation what happend from the Dazzler's side.
She got her foal, without you there around.
That was a very big disapointment for you, because you were prepared to imprint the foal in his first hour. You were happy and disappointed because you couldn't do what you planned for many month.
The first thing where I am thinking of is, is this the first foal for Dazzler? I couldn't find it here above. Because if it isn't and she had bad experiences with other owners, maybe that's why she reacting like this.
It could be also possible that you are so disapointed and also happy, that she sees your bodylanquage and reacts on this!!! It is different what you are always doing so she is confused. Now she has her foal, you react differently and maybe that's why she protect her foal more.
Is that possible?

Gen, I am sure that this what happends/happens is with a reason. You see that she excepts you more and more and that you give her trust.
And with all those wonderfull comments above you see that you are making progress.
Do things what you always were doing but now step by step.
You're getting a much happier feeling and Dazzler will feel that and trust you more and more so in a few days hopefully you can touch the foal.

Hope you will spend more beautifull hours with those two and leave the house for what it is hihi...

So it means for you no Christmas celebrations in the house but in the stable. Put your bed there and a Christmastree and don't fall a sleep!!!!

Cheers, May.

Hi Gen,

Good job! You can be really proud of yourself, she showed you how important comunication is and you did it right!
I'm sure we all felt for you and still do, so please let us know how Dazzler and her foal are doing in the time to come. What's his name? You might call him Forum.....
You have another foal coming, still time to prepare yourself and your Intro Course with Lynn, this is going to be so great!
Take care,
Miriam

Gen - this is great news! You shouldn't be disappointed that you weren't there at the birth as it is just wonderful that your mare had her foal by herself and didn't have any complications. It also means that Dazzler is a great Mum and bonded immediately with her foal which is great - this may not have happened if you had tried to imprint the foal at birth. Imprinting is a hard one as it could have adverse effects. Years ago when still children my sister and I rubbed a foal down when it was first born and then the young mother refused to accept it. The foal subsequently died and we were devestated. That is why I knew to keep away from Pie's foal as soon as Pie got up. Although I helped Tricka up onto her wobbly legs I was careful not to touch her too much at that stage and not to interfere with the after birth still on her and leave that for Pie to lick off. Same with calves of young heifers if you interfere too much the mothers wont take their calves. So in retrospect everything may have worked out for the best in your case. Now just keep working on Dazzler until she is relaxed and trusting and then very slowly and cautiously start including the foal. Be very careful here as Dazzler is obviously a very protective, good Mum and she may quickly re-act dangerously if she fears you are threatening her foal in anyway. It will be great if she lets you touch the foal soon but don't be in a hurry to do this - stay safe!! Keep us in touch with your progress!!

Hi Kicki
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Yes, its funny you say I might have been lucky to miss the birth because that crossed my mind as well. But I am very observant with body language so I would have gotten out of ther pretty quick if it looked like I was unwelcome - and I definately don't think I would have been. Thank you :-)
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Hi May
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Yes I think you have hit the nail on the head here :-) This is Dazzler's 3rd foal. I am not too sure how she has been handled in the past, but her body language suggests her handling hasn't been without some roughness. I think someone has used an Ear Twitch on her at one point because there is a fine scar around the base of her left ear, and it took me about 4 weeks to be able to touch her ears... It would have been great to do join-up with her but she was too pregnant and a bit under nourished when I bought her home.
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Yes, I will be spending Christmas in the stable :-) Just like Mary and Joseph. I am fortunate that I was able to do some good join-ups with Babe before I got her in foal so she should be a lot easier to get along with. But if she tells me I am not welcome, I will back off.
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Hi Miriam
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Thank you so much. Horses really are the best teachers of their language, and I have learnt a lot from this experience. The intro course will fill in so many gaps for me and its not far away now! Very excited.
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We are hoping to have the foal registered as:
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Dazlin Chickasha Cadillac
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but Forum sounds like a good stable name lol :-)
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He is a double cross of Chickasha Dan a quarter horse who was imported from the US into Australia in the early 1970's. Other bloodlines he has include Doc's Yakoon, War Leo, Flapper's Breeze and Amaroo Little Bobby Lena. He really is a beautiful little fellow :-)
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Thank you so much again everyone.
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Kind regards,
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Gen