Hi all,
Oké, where shall I start.....
This morning I went with my friend to somebody who sells western saddles. I wanted to see if it was possible to buy myself a saddle for Renske.
I took some pictures from Renske's back, standing still, walking and in canter. The lady told me that it was not possible to put on Renske a western saddle. That was very honoust of her. I had the english saddle from Renske with me and asked the lady to check this for me, because I had the feeling that there was something wrong with it. I always have the feeling that I am not in balance when I am riding Renske.
Well it came out that the saddle is broken, what we call a broken tree... or maybe you call it beam. What you can do with the saddle is when you push on the back of it you will see on the seat a crack. The lady told me that this is not good and she adviced me not to ride with this saddle anymore. Also the two "cusions" under the saddle are not the same thickness, so that's the unbalance I feel.
I came back with this story to the owner from Renske.
There is an other lady riding Renske now, also a beginner, (I am not happy with that, but I can't say anything because Renske is not my horse.) She came a few month ago and the owner agreed on it, that she can ride Renske as well.
When she heard about the broken saddle her reaction was; "oh.... I have always rode with that saddle and I don't feel anything so it doesn't matter, for the time that I am riding Renske, it is not every day".
I told the owner that it can cause back injury for Renske, but even the owner is not lissening to me. I feel very sorry for Renske.
I can buy myself an new saddle, but then still the broken one will be used.
HELP, what can I do????
Cheers, May.
Oh May i really do feel for you in tis situation! How terrible it must be to know the problem can be fixed but not have the power to do so.
Unfortunately as Renske is not your horse there is probably not a great deal you can do. I would just keep stressing that the current saddle is not suitable and if you can i would show the owner the broken tree and uneven padding. The rest is up to her. I guess this is one of the downfalls of falling in love with a horse that is not your own. You just keep doing the best you can for Renske when you are with him and hopefully if you be persistent with the saddle issue then something might change!
All the best :-)
Janelle
Hi Janelle,
Thank you for your advice. I wil continue to tell the owner about the saddle. I already showed him the broken tree and uneven padding.
It is also the other lady who is riding Renske now, who is not worried about the broken saddle. So it makes two of them now.
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Yes, it is very difficult to deal with a horse what is not yours and you want the best for them.
Let's hope the owner will see the problem and come to the conclusion that this is not right for his horse.
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Thank's again, May
May, I'm really sorry.
Unfortunately there is not much one can do when we don't own the horse or horses we ride.
When I go to the stables I use, the trainer/owner does things her way, definetly not mine.
I have to follow her way while I am there but whatever horse I choose that day to ride I give it extra special treatment, a little extra something.
For me, if I were put into a dangerous situation, such as an unbalanced saddle, I would be letting her know I will not ride with any unsafe equipment.
With MY STAR, my baby who belongs to me, I will not buy another saddle until she is finished growing. I will not be riding her until next spring.
Her saddle is only to help her get use to having one on her back.
Another point, you cannot fit a saddle by pictures, it's immpossible.
You have to borrow, from the saddle maker, an instrument to fit the horse, wire does not work either.
And as far as a western saddle is concerned, you can fit any horse with one.
Sounds to me as if this person does not know what they are doing.
The owner of Renske does not sound very responsible to me, to allow a horse to be ruined or put their clients at risk does not sound like good business to me. They will loose money on practising such unsound deliberate neglect.
You keep expressing what is right.
I wish you could purchase him.
Ronda
PS: Didn't you fall off a horse? Is this the same place where it happened? Sorry I have short term memory loss and can't remember :)
Hi Ronda,
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Thank you for your advices and experiences.
Yes, I fell of Renske beginning of June. Yesterday I told my husband that it was possible also because of the unbalanced saddle. I always have the feeling that I am out of balance with this saddle.
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My friend has an western saddle and I rode on that one a few times and I like it very much also because I don't have the feeling to be out of balance.
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You are right that you can't buy a saddle from just showing them pictures. What I forgot to tell (sorry) is that she wanted to see in the first place if it was possible to get a saddle for Renske. If that was so she would come to me with all the saddles to fit one for Renske.
She explained to me that not every horse can have a western saddle, because of the back. When the back is bending and the head is up and the shoulder is straight, when the horse is in a canter it is not possible, because the saddle will go to far to the back and then you will sit to far away from the back, centre and give to much pressure on that part of the body. This will do the horse buck.(Her explanation.)
The owner is a farmer, dealing with horses his whole live and he is thinking different from the way I am thinking.
He is very easy and he is not very concerned about the saddle and the possibility of Renske's back. He says; you and the other lady don't ride frequently, every day, so it doesn't matter.
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I wish I could do more for Renske, she is 17 now and did a lot of work for a lot of people. She worked hard and now this!!!!
I am brushing her and give her massages and give her my attention. I am doing groundwork with her and did ride again, just in step to start with (because of my fall).
I will see how the owner is thinking monday about the saddle, maybe he changed his mind.
I will keep telling him and see if I can do more.
Thank´s again, have a nioce weekend, May
May
There are plenty of western saddles that would fit your horse but the problem is you have to fit the saddle and you cannot do that online. If I were forced to ride a broken tree, I would first want to know where on the tree is it broken. My guess is it is going to be at either end of the saddle and not in the center. Either way you can help compensate somewhat by using additional pads. I ride with a wool blanket then my saddle pad, which is quite soft but firm. One thing about feeling unbalanced when riding could be caused not by the saddle being broken but by the length of the stirrups or if you have one leg longer that the other your pressure on the stirrups will be different and trough your balance off.
Good luck and Cheers!
Hi Dennis,
Thank you.
The saddle is broken just out of the middle, to the back.
I will see what I can do with an extra blanket or pad to compensate it.
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Unbalanced riding is realy because of the uneven padding. I can see a difference between the right and the left one in thickness. When I sit in the saddle I can feel that I am out of balance to the left.
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It's good to tell me about the legs and the length of the stirrups etc. I thought about it to.
Thank's again for helping me.
May.
Hi May - this is a sad story and the situation must be so frustrating for you. If the saddle is that unbalanced perhaps you could insert a bit of thin foam rubber into a pad to go under the saddle to improve its balance. Cut out two pieces of fairly strong material the same shape but slightly larger than your saddle. Sew the material together as you would when making a cushion but leave the bottom of the left side open. Turn it inside out then sew down the centre back to form a pouch on the left side. Then cut a piece of thin foam rubber into the shape of the pouch you have ready, insert it and sew up the bottom of the pouch. When you have finished it will look like a saddle blacket the shape of your saddle but the left hand side will be slightly wider as it holds the foam rubber. Use this pad you have made on top of your usual saddle blnket and immediately under your saddle. For the broken tree I would suggest a jell pad as the best solution but the owner does need to buy a new saddle for Renski so try gentle persuasion on him pointing out the damage he may do to Renski and Renski's riders If Renski bucked you off when you were injured then the badly fitted broken stemmed saddle was probably the reason why she bucked.
Hi May,
I love the memory foam pads and they don't cost too much.
I put that directly against the horses back then the saddle pad or blanket and then the saddle.
And this is with a good saddle, it's more comfortable for both the rider and horse, it also takes the shape of that horse, so keep it just for her, OK.
I agree with Maggie, talk this fellow into a new saddle and equipment, I don't want you hurt.
I want to meet you one day at flag is up farms, so you take care,
Ronda
Hi Maggie,
You have given me some wonderful ideas, thank you so much.
Ronda
Hi Maggie,
Thank you for the ideas, I am going to look into that as well and see if I can make myself such a "pad".
You will all hear from me how things are going.
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Hi Ronda,
Yes, I want to talk to him again. And maybe if he sees that I make it more better for Renske, he relises that I am serieus about this.
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Cheers, May.
Hi all,
This morning I went to Renske and I gave her my attention. She loves that and most of the time she is making that sound buhbuhbuh.... when I am coming into her stable.
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The owner told me that he checked the saddle and he and the lady who also rides Renske now, came to the conclusion that the saddle was not broken!!!!
He says; I don't know a lot of saddles, but this one is not broken otherwise all three saddles we have here are broken.
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Well that's it, faoks, problem solved.
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The lady who is riding Renkse, rides her for hours also in trot and canter and nothing is wrong she says.
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Can anybody tell me how it is possible, that I can feel that something is wrong with the saddle, out of balance, and somebody else doesn't feel it?
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Am I harping on this subject? Just tell me...
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It gives me a very bad feeling and the owner said I can ride Renske with the not broken saddle.
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The unbalance... is it possible if you always mount up on the left side that the saddle gets out of balance over the years because you every time puts pressure on it? The left side of the pad is thinner then the right one.
What I understood is that the owner never let the saddle check!!!
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Cheers everyone, May
Good morning May,
I have question for you if that is OK.
How long have you been riding and how many different horses have you ridden?
Keeping a saddle for years, if it's used a lot by different people, size and weight can ruin it for sure. Everything goes wrong with it.
The thing to be concerned with is the pressure points it can cause on the horses' back.
Honestly May, there is not much more you can do about this situation.
I know it's frustrating but try to keep yourself calm and enjoy her as much as you can.
Have a good day,
Ronda
Good morning May,
I have question for you if that is OK.
How long have you been riding and how many different horses have you ridden?
Keeping a saddle for years, if it's used a lot by different people, size and weight can ruin it for sure. Everything goes wrong with it.
The thing to be concerned with is the pressure points it can cause on the horses' back.
Honestly May, there is not much more you can do about this situation.
I know it's frustrating but try to keep yourself calm and enjoy her as much as you can.
Have a good day,
Ronda
Hi Ronda,
I am trying to ride now for I think 4 years. Every time there is something.
I started with a friend who needed somebody who could ride her horse. She gave me lessons and we had a few rides in the woods. Just step and canter. One day I was riding Femke (the name of the horse) and she started to walk with a limp. My friend said; oh that's nothing go on, keep her moving. I didn't do that, because I felt there was something wrong, so I got of Femke and the end of the story is that there was something wrong with her leg and it took month before she was recovered. My friend disided to sell her.
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I started at a riding school, but..... no good instructions, so after 5 lessons I stopped with that.
Now with Renske... you know the story.
And an other friend has a horse and I rode hers a few times.
So that are 4 horses in a few times/years.
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That's a good suggestion, Ronda to keep myself calm. That is very difficult, because it makes me angry and sad and sometimes in tears (sorry, I am a very sensitive person).
What I did this morning was good, just brush and stroke her and give her my full attention.
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Thank you again, have a nice day, May.
Hi May,
Is it possible for you to borrow a saddle from one of your friends, who has a horse similiar in size and shape to Renske?
I wonder if you could wether the difference it made to you both would be proof to the other lady or owner.
It would certainly give you a lot more confidence in the saddle.
Sometimes people cannot see what is right in front of them and you have to go that one step further for them to realise that you have a point.
Be strong, and calm and carry on with your desire to sort this problem, horses cant speak for themselves and we are all they have sometimes.
The young lady you met with me was a friends daughter, I had a spare ticket to see Monty and was hoping that she would enjoy it, she did , but being young she has her own ideas on how to treat horses, she will learn.
The little black horse that I joined up with and spent 3 months training, has now gone to a lovely new home, he is so happy now I feel lucky to have met him and spent time in his company.
Chin up May, you can do it, thinking of you
Sandie
May I am feeling for you over this one but as you don't own Renske or the saddle there seems to be little you can do. I fear if you push it too far then the owner will not allow you to see or ride Renske any longer and that would be sad for you both. Sandie's idea of borrowing a saddle sounds like a good one but you would need to check with the owner that it was alright to use this different saddle on Renske. He may well say "no". It is a sad, frustrating and difficult situation for you but I doubt if there is much you can do now.
Hi Sandie and Maggie,
No, it is not possible to borrow a saddle the size Renske will fit (good idea). So I have to do it with the broken saddle.
What I will check is when the saddle comes from Renske after a ride how she was sweatting. If I can see some part were no sweat is, there will be a point of pressure.
Yes Maggie, I will keep myself quiete, because otherwise the owner can say; I think you are not thinking how I am thinking so it is better not to come anymore.
I will do a lot of brushing and massaging Renske, she loves that. And I will look into the extra pads, blankets etc to make it more comfortable for Renske and me.
Thank you for your advices and you will hear if something is changing.
Cheers, May.
Hi May
It is my understanding this is an English Saddle. The Padding in the back of the saddle needs to be needed on a monthly basis to keep it in the correct shape. A saddle maker showed me years ago on an old used Stubben Tristan (??) Saddle. You basically massage the pad from the outside. Lifting the outer edge and pushing it to the center. Basically you are trying to fluff it back up.. Look at some new similar saddles to get the idea of the proper shape and give it a go. You will have to do this every time you ride to give the padding a better memory. Personally I would try and purchase a better used saddle for when I rode this horse. Sorry to say the only way to change the owners mind is for him to see how much better Renske does with your equipment.
I agree with Dennis that you can fit any horse in a Western Saddle. It is a Matter of the Correct Tree and an Open Mind. Skirt Length can be a problem with some. I prefer short backed Quarter Horses so I have a Roping Saddle with a Rounded Skirt designed and made just for me by an old friend that was a saddle maker. On the other hand I picked up a Used Very Nice out of date 1981 Show saddle for $250 for my Morgan. Several Years ago. New this Saddle was much more $$$
In this economy there are very good saddles selling at low prices. Just make sure the person selling it has the right to sell it. Ask for pictures of it in use over the years to ensure that the saddle is not stolen.
May one thing you might think about in your journey to become a better rider. This situation could hamper your ability to learn to ride properly. You would be more Secure in a proper saddle. Your confidence and muscles would develop better in a proper saddle.
You might consider just being on the ground with Renske and take lessons with a caring Like Minded Horseman someplace else. Horse people come with many opinions you will not change. Nurture your Love Of Horses and find someone that can help you do that.
Hi May
I haven't been on for a couple of days, so I just found this topic.
I am very sorry for you, and even more so for Renske!
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You just don't ride in a saddle with a broken tree as it can cause serious damage to the horse's back.
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I just can't believe that the owner chooses to go on what another *beginner* rider says, when you have already asked a professional. Surely they must have seen the wrinkles in the leather where the crack is?
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The different sized "cushions" underneath is the result of a longterm wear and tear where the rider has been sitting down heavier on one side of the saddle than the other. (Sometimes because the horse places them there.) It will also cause difficulties for the horse to develop muscles evenly since it will have to work more with one side.
And of course the saddle will be pulled askew from riders always mounting from one side. (I always shift sides or use a stool!)
That is easily fixed, though, compared to the broken tree.
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I really hope you can find a solution for Renske and you. Fingers crossed very hard!
Hi Amber,
Thank you for your advice. I will see what I can do to massage that cusion/pad.
Thursday I will have a lesson on Renske. My instructor is coming to me and we will see if we can use an other saddle, hopefully it fits.
The saddle with the broken tree was never checked. Not by the owner nor the saddlemaker.
I have to say that I learn a lot of all of you.
I never relised how sensitive this is for the horse and the rider.
I will look into the western saddle again, if there is a possibility for Renske. Maybe the lady who told me, that it was not possible, has to come to me and check Renske again.
And I will consider to ride an other horse for the lessons and do groundwork with Renske, maybe there is a possibility.
Thanks again Amberpony, cheers, May
Hi Kicky,
Excactly what you are saying, is what I am thinking and knowing now.
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The point is I am a beginner and it looks like the owner will not listen to me because; how could I know. (Well it wasn't me, but an expert saddlemaker who noticed it. I just told the owner what we discovered.)
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I can do what I want to stay in balance on Renske, but I feel that it is wrong and also when I try to let Renske walk in a straight line she is not doing it, because of the unbalance. I have to correct her and also that doesn't feel right, because I have to pull on the reigns.
In the beginning I thought it was my fault that she is not walking in one line. I give to much pressure on one side, but what I tryed it didn't work. I understand now why.
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Hope there will come a solution to this problem soon.
I just got the Intelligent Horsemanship magazine from Kelly Marks.( I am a member of the IH) In this magazine they are talking about; Stable in the saddle. I will read that and I am going to do those exercises. So IF I get an other saddle I will be more stable then now.
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Thank's for your support.
Cheers May.
Hi all,
This morning I went to Renske.
I was preparing her for my ridinglesson, but it was pouring with rain.
So I asked my instructor to come over and see what we could do.
Well the first thing was to try an other saddle, what was in the tackroom, on Renske!!!! It is alright but needs some more attention. We putted an extra blanket underneath the saddle and it was much better.Can you emagine how happy I was???? The owner got this saddle from somebody.
So we started in step with the "new" saddle and Renske was jumpy. My instructor says that she can see that the other lady is riding on Renske in a very different way, more straight and hold Renske tider. My instructor knows this lady as well.
After 5 minutes Renske was oké with me and relised that somebody else was riding her.
The 'new' saddle is much better then the other, broken, one and I can feel myself more in balance.
Also Renske is acting differently.
The owner asked somebody else to check the broken saddle and also he said that it was not broken!?!?.
The lady (also a beginner!!)who is also riding Renske checked the 'new' saddle and said that it was oké, so the owner bought this saddle now for Renske.
My instructor and I will work on it to make it as much comfortable for Renkse as what is possible.
It gave me a lot of tears and bad feeling, but this morning I could feel that Renske was more happy and she was so relaxed.
I did canter for the first time again after my fall half year ago and it went alright.
I am proud of Renske and also about myself.. ha....
Everytime when she did alright I gave her a stroke and she was looking back to see me. She was so good. I am working on soft signals now and she is reacting on that much better.
Also going/walking in a straight line goes alright now.
I realy understand now how important it is that a saddle has to fit!!!!
So if I can tell you more, you will hear from me.
Thank's all for supporting me and giving ideas, it all helped.
Bye, have a nice day, May.
*LOL* May! Your excitement is shining through in your words. I'm glad things seems to turn out fine. It's so important that saddles fit properly. It can change everything - esp. for the health of the back of the horse.
Keep in mind that Renske's back might be sore and she might get tired faster with the new saddle since she isn't used to it - like a pair of new shoes.
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Good for you cantering!!! Congrats and pat yourself on the back!
Hi Kicki,
Thank's for the advice, I will keep this in mind when I am riding Renske.
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Yes, it is unbelievable how I could see the changes when I was riding Renske. And how happy I was/am.
Today I will ride her again, just practising and not to long. It is bad weather here in Holland now, a lot of rain, so the fields are one big pool and the sandschool is realy out of use now. For the ones who want to know, Holland is flat. And when I say flat it is FLAT. Only in the very south of Holland we have some hills, but I think you will laugh about those hills.
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Ha, do you mind Kicky that I pat myself on the shoulders I can't reach my back.. hihi..
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Have a nice weekend and fun with the horses.
Bye, May.
Great news May and well done! You should be proud of yourself for firstly managing to get the owner to buy another saddle for Renske and secondly for cantering lher again.
Have a wonderful Christmas and all the best for a great 2012.
Way to Go May! Glad you are getting on better with your situation. Nice to Hear you Excited Words.
Congratulations May with your whole 'journey', if I can call it that! I'm really happy for you that things are going better now with Renske and all :) I hope it will continue to just get better and better for you!
Also, I used to live in Holland too so I know what you mean by it being flat! I think that pretty much only the dunes along the coast aren't flat :p
May is no longer on the forum. It's great to bring up some old posts but some of them have already been sloved.
We had some recent posts that needed addressed and now they are gone!!!!
What's going on????
They're gone? That's weird!
looking for input. anyone out there have any experience or dirt on the circle y treeless saddles called just-b-natureal. appreciate your comments. thanks
Hi hines,
There was a great posting on saddles on the forum before. If you would like some information you can type in the search bar or go to the forum icon and look through the postings.
You will enjoy the information.
Hi again hines,
I brought up a post for you from the forum about treeless saddles. I hope it helps.
Different viewpoints and different research. Also, from one who loves them!!!!
ronda
Star that is really nice that you found the saddle information for hinesj001 If you copy and paste the persons name (hinesj001) you are trying to communicate with they could find your posts by putting their name in the search engine. Hope this helps you connect with others better.
Diana