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My horse intimidates by turning her rump as if to kick

By:
krista jane
Date:
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When I was a young girl, my grandparents kept Shetland ponies on their farm, and I was kicked by one while in a large stall.  I assumed that the pony was comfortable with us two young cousins and two ponies in the large box stall, but when I wasn't watching one, it kicked me square in the backside. I still remember this experience, and allow my mare to move me away from her back end if she postures herself to "square" her back end toward me and act as if she would kick. She also pins her ears and gets that tense stance, so I know I am reading her body language correctly. I have used the Uni methods and the black dually to school her, and she is gentle as a lamb when she knows we are working on leading, standing still or loading in the trailer.  But, there are times when in a situation with other horses, or with other distractions that she can get bossy, and I don't see any lessons on what to do when she does this.  I find myself caught off guard, and she has gotten away with the behaviour, sometimes she will try this while loading. I would really be interested in a suitable lesson.  What I would really love is to come and learn at Flag is Up Farms, I have been there as a guest, but never as a student. I live in Ontario, Canada, so watching people without hats, mitts, and winter coats working with horses in glossy coats gives me an escape from reality on January days.  Thanks for the Uni.  
JoHewittVINTA
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Hi Krista Jane. Perhaps you know that you can't be kicked if you're really close - no room for the hooves to get height & be powered out. I once dealt with a 3 year old filly called Beauty who turned her rump on me in the stable. This was a habit shown to all who entered. I stepped up to her, put my arms around her bottom & scratched her gently saying "what a beautiful bottom". She was shocked. She turned her head with an expression which said " who the hell are you? That's my best threat. It always works ". It took maybe 5 or 6 repetitions of me returning to the stable, getting rump instead of head, cuddling the rump & leaving again to literally cure the behaviour. Alternatively, immediately step to her shoulder & gently move her, repeatedly. Causing her to have to move her feet is Equus for you saying 'I'm in charge'. Just a few steps is enough, 4 or 5. You need to pause for about 5 seconds, enough time to change sides as presumably your stable has limited space, then repeat. Direction isn't important so long as it is away from you. My homebred youngsters were about 5 months old when, for different reasons, they more dabbed me than kicked me & after 4 or 5 times each, one a colt & the other a filly, looked at me as if to say " You're really not pleased with me, are you ". I can potter around them with complete safety, although when they back up for tail base scratching some visitors are bemused/terrified/confused. Thought: she's only threatened to kick but never actually done it - something has frightened her & I bet she's more worried than you are. Love her out of it by standing your ground, taking control & becoming her safe place. Good luck & keep in touch. Cheers, Jo.
Miriam (Holland&Germany)
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed 650 lessons completed
Hi Krista Jane,
Since I haven't seen you on the forum, I'd like to say welcome to you first!
Good to have you with us...
Your enthousiasm about the Uni, Flag Is Up Farms and Monty's methods is what we all have in common here. What I'd like to add to it, is that the courses offered in Solvang and by the Certified Instructors worldwide will help you take the first step of a lifelong journey of learning. Monty often states that he's still learning every day, every horse and every situation is different. Let me encourage you to make that investment in your own life and that of your horses, it's worth it! I know it from my personal experience! There are instructors in Canada, click the tab 'Instructors' at the top of the page, and find one near you! Or go to California and enjoy working with the horses at Flag Is Up, learning in that very special place! If you're lucky you might find Monty at home, working with whatever horses need his personal attention.
Live your dream...and please keep in contact with the forum!
Miriam
 
bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed
HI kRISTA jANE;  The one common thread that I always find on the forum commentary would be very fine advice and genuine concern to help folks with their horses.  I believe that you will find your way through what is a problem now for you by following the above advice.   Good luck and please keep us posted on how this turns out for you.

Bud
a.rumble
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Hi, Krista Jane,
      You and me both would like to go to Flag is up farms for our learning of many things.I'm like yourself and live in Canada only I live in N.B.Canada. Never been to California for any reason. There is so much we could learn! What I find most people think about Canada is that we all are living not to far from each other what they do not realize is we are all quite far away from each other.Alberta, Ontario and New Brunswick are all 1000's of miles apart from each other. If we had the money we could go to California just as easy!  I always teach my horses to get over with their bums from the time they are babies up, so they learn incrementally to get their bums away from me very young in life. I just put my finger on their hip depending what side I'm on and say over. They get a good loving when they do as they have learnt. I can go in around any of them and clean them out or whatever and never any problems that way at all. Even my Stallion. Hope this helps you Krista Jane. Keep in touch if you would like to,I would love to hear how your making out with your horse as well. Take care & be careful always!!
Kicki -- Sweden
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed
Jo,
This is totally off topic - and I know you can't give me an answer! - but I am very curious which extra (?) lesson I have missed that you have watched to have 450 when I know I have watched (and answered) all of them and only have 449???
It's a mystery! :D :D


JoHewittVINTA
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Hi Kicki. Well including today's I'm up to 453. Seems you've got 4 to find & finish. It's my habit once a series is complete to rewatch the whole thing in one go - helps to gel it into my brain & occasionally I've found an un-ticked lesson, even though I know I've already done it in full. So I redo it. Cheers, Jo.
Kicki -- Sweden
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed
Thanks for the replay, Jo! The mystery is still there, though! LOL!
I will look again, but I've been going through the lessons twice already and they are all ticked. I can see missing one un-ticked, but four? Heh, I'm missing some thing, that's for sure!
Sorry, Krista Jane, for hijacking your thread!
In regards to your problem, I'm not sure I can offer anything you haven't already thought of. I do note that both your problem horses are/were mares, which doesn't surprise me. In my experience this is a natural way for mares to communicate.

They do it with unsolicited "suitors" as well as with their babies, or whenever they feel they need to let some one else know they are not amused.

I'm not saying they all are this way or that it can't be remedied, but I think it pays to remember that some mares can be "geared" that way more than others and maybe sometimes it's more of a reflex than a thought out behaviour.
Whether that warrants different approaches in the training, I leave to the more experienced among us to answer. :)

star
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed
Hi, my mare tries that as well. Not in her stall but her outside pen. By her body language one of us has done something that she is not pleased with. If I see her do this I immediately clap my hands loudly together, to get her attention and say get. She does and then is happy.
When I am beside her and Iwant her to move I say over and she moves over. 
This has taken incremental learning on her part, being persistent and firm. Mean what you say without being mean.
Now whenever anyone walks beside her she immediately moves over, out of their way.
This is very handy when you are in a busy barn with a lot of people walking around and there is only one hallway for grooming.
Hope this helps in some way.
DrJulieH
Hello!
Hello all, my name is Julie.  I had a yearling double back kicked me in the chest.  I am training her and she has only been here a week.  When I picked her up, she turned her hindquarters towards me and kicked out the first day.  Any suggestions?  Thank you 😊 
JoHewittVINTA
Please upload your photo 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed 650 lessons completed
Hi Julie. Welcome to the Uni. This youngster is acting out of fear - the need to survive. Just consider for a moment what has happened to her already, in her short life. She's lost her family, her home & her friends so she feels an overwhelming need to fight for her life. Your  best option is to be her new best friend. Those of us who have used Monty's methods for a while have seen the incredible benefits of slow is fast. Having already been kicked you will have more difficulty staying really calm & controlling your breathing but this is a MUST. Do NOT punish her - this has already been done & she's still kicking people so punishment isn't going to work. Instead, try a reassuring rub - show her you understand she has concerns but everything will be ok. Taking a few days to gain her trust will speed you both through her early training so there will be no overall time loss but a huge gain as your bond with this horse grows. I recently moved a horse that had been a brood mare only recently brought back into ridden work. I was greeted by a very unimpressed, short tempered, unhappy horse. She loaded like a horse fearful of the consequences of not loading & I felt the draft of her back hoof as it past my knee as I closed over the bum bar. I scratched her rump - to her surprise, not to reward but to reassure. We had about 30 miles to travel & had a pleasant, gentle, unhurried journey. The horse that calmly off loaded at our journeys end was a world away from the fractious, nervous, tanking individual that was loaded on less than an hour earlier - total mindset changed by simple understanding & logical, non violent handling. I refer you to my much earlier post 'Trust is a two way street' regarding my youngsters. Good luck with this girl. Keep us updated on how things progress. Cheers, Jo.

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